tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post8214248665778650770..comments2024-03-07T00:24:23.674-05:00Comments on FBC Jax Watchdogs: Inside Story: Ergun Caner Was Finally Shown the Door by Liberty OfficialsFBC Jax Watchdoghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10740366031265491559noreply@blogger.comBlogger164125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-85386197360275568922012-02-24T00:16:26.477-05:002012-02-24T00:16:26.477-05:00Part 2
I feel as if the largest body of Christia...Part 2<br /> I feel as if the largest body of Christian protesters of Ergun's apparent silence publicly on these accusatory issues regarding profession of sin and repentance offering to us offended brothers do not have meanness of spirit in their hearts toward him but concern for his "doing the Biblically advised thing" toward those left without publicly-directed specifics of repentance for wrong that he so readily offered in the private setting you, Tim Lee, refer to - the obviously private lofty perches at LU's administration.<br /> Remember, Jimmy Swaggert came to public media-covered repentance to his TV audience so unashamedly and in absence of personal pridefulness that the larger Christian body drew him back in in welcome heartfelt forgiveness.<br /> I trust in all this that it encourages us all as Christians to more exclusively and explicitly put our faith in the dependability of righteous example God only in Jesus Christ only gives in the Bible only, and never, never, never put trust in the holiest-seeming examples of Christian leadership. Guys like you Tim Lee, and Ergun, the rest - are every one as guilty and sinful as the rest of the anonymous body of our mutual Christ, and it's a dangerous thing to allow mass exposure of media and church organization speaking invitations to convince oneself to any degree that the wrong one can do can be resolved without repentance to those brothers wronged.<br /> Many of us, speaking from personal experience, life lives of humble change from having repented of great but unpublicized wrongs we did for the remainder of our lives, not balking at the repentance to the wronged, and living thereafter with the conscience and behavior burden to live differently than before in Jesus' eyes.<br /> Just so you know, Tim, my anonymity in use of a screen nom de plume is to keep virus and spam ID software scouring the web from detecting my name, ID, other pertinent data I want to protect from thieves. If you want to know me to talk with I invite it but expect you'll give it the same attention you gave when I posted a comment on Ergun and your support of him to the only available contact with you through your ministry web site. <br /> Ergun's historically recorded statements were the divisive action in the Body. The Christian body's responses to this are not the divisive source. We need to try to not confuse or intermix the two in origin and implication. You quickly got way off the issue of the Christian public's reason for speaking of Ergun's action (or resultant inaction of no public statement to the Body about repentance) here and I welcome personal one on one contact to convey my feelings about this and hear yours openly. Let me know here as a start if you wish.<br /> God bless us all, bring us all as a Body ever closer in support and encouragement for and to each other in our lives here, and answer our faith with Heaven's fulfillment.<br />Psalms 91Tim Millshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14558958232650392332noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-71348518252081636372012-01-31T08:02:27.519-05:002012-01-31T08:02:27.519-05:00Wow.
I did follow this whole thing for some time...Wow. <br /><br />I did follow this whole thing for some time after becoming familiar with the Caners through the Caner-White debate that was cancelled.<br /><br />In Luke 13 Jesus says, "Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them, do you think that they were worse sinners than all other men who dwelt in Jerusalem? 5 I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.”<br /><br />When we see things like this happen- providentially, God had brought to light certain facts and removed this man from his place of authority- what is the lesson for us? <br /><br />We all need to take a deep look into our our own hearts, repent and commit ourselves to Christ- following Him in faith and obedience. Let's judge ourselves so others in the body of Christ don't have too.<br /><br />I'm not against this blog- this stuff is necessary. I know Christ desires purity in the body just like He desires purity in me personally. But let us not miss the personal, internal applications that Scripture clearly calls us to as well as the necessary, external grief we know when a believer falls.<br /><br />Thanks for all the comments on this site- some of them were absolutely brillant.Mike in VAnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-56712184324245538362011-09-24T17:24:18.206-04:002011-09-24T17:24:18.206-04:00As a graduate from Liberty University 2010, I'...As a graduate from Liberty University 2010, I'm embarrassed over the Caner controversy. I'm also embarrassed how Liberty handled it and how they can't call a spade a spade. <br /><br />This double speak may be acceptable in politics today, but should not be coming from a Christian school. A lie is a lie, and Caner lied. It was not a misspeak of factual statements or however they put it. <br /><br />Love of money is the root of all evil and unfortunately the love of money that Caner brought in was more important than the love of God and truth. <br /><br />Scot BrandonThePlentifulHarvesthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17865801526065849349noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-50694119756428002552011-07-18T12:38:53.748-04:002011-07-18T12:38:53.748-04:00I have to say that I'm in the middle on the Er...I have to say that I'm in the middle on the Ergun Caner controversy. On one hand, I did find him a blessing from my favorite book Costly Call Part 1, to his visits to my church, to his podcasts. Love him or hate him, he produced much fruit. On the other hand, I do believe that he did wrong. I can't ignore the decidely more 'Arab' way he started to look after 9/11. And the video shown of him speaking jibberish and trying to pass it off as Arabic (I speak Arabic BTW) is nothing anyone can explain away I don't care how many hours you've spent with him. I mean Arabic is not even the language of Turkey! He definitely aimed to deceive in the pursuit of fame and fortune from books/speaking engagements. However, I don't think we should shoot our wounded. He does not deserve to be restored to his previous position, but he does deserve intercessary prayer, not judgement.Richellenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-56092949301522115482011-07-18T01:49:04.701-04:002011-07-18T01:49:04.701-04:00I don't think Tim Lee is putting the weight of...I don't think Tim Lee is putting the weight of everything into place. I remember a guy by the name of Mike Warnke that made sensational statements in the eighties in believing he was doing a service. It shipwrecked some I sure when they found out his past was a hoax.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-39180364962267597922011-07-11T23:08:59.181-04:002011-07-11T23:08:59.181-04:00Matthew 23
Then Jesus said to the crowds and to h...Matthew 23<br /> Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples, 2 “The scribes and the Pharisees sit on Moses’ seat, 3 so practice and observe whatever they tell you—but not what they do. For they preach, but do not practice. 4 They tie up heavy burdens, hard to bear, and lay them on people’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to move them with their finger. 5 They do all their deeds to be seen by others. For they make their phylacteries broad and their fringes long, 6 and they love the place of honor at feasts and the best seats in the synagogues 7 and greetings in the marketplaces and being called rabbi by others. 8 But you are not to be called rabbi, for you have one teacher, and you are all brothers. 9 And call no man your father on earth, for you have one Father, who is in heaven. 10 Neither be called instructors, for you have one instructor, the Christ. 11 The greatest among you shall be your servant. 12 Whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and whoever humbles himself will be exalted. <br />13 “But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you shut the kingdom of heaven in people’s faces. For you neither enter yourselves nor allow those who would enter to go in. 15 Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you travel across sea and land to make a single proselyte, and when he becomes a proselyte, you make him twice as much a child of hell as yourselves. <br />16 “Woe to you, blind guides, who say, ‘If anyone swears by the temple, it is nothing, but if anyone swears by the gold of the temple, he is bound by his oath.’ 17 You blind fools! For which is greater, the gold or the temple that has made the gold sacred? 18 And you say, ‘If anyone swears by the altar, it is nothing, but if anyone swears by the gift that is on the altar, he is bound by his oath.’ 19 You blind men! For which is greater, the gift or the altar that makes the gift sacred? 20 So whoever swears by the altar swears by it and by everything on it. 21 And whoever swears by the temple swears by it and by him who dwells in it. 22 And whoever swears by heaven swears by the throne of God and by him who sits upon it. <br />23 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you tithe mint and dill and cumin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the law: justice and mercy and faithfulness. These you ought to have done, without neglecting the others. 24 You blind guides, straining out a gnat and swallowing a camel! <br />25 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you clean the outside of the cup and the plate, but inside they are full of greed and self-indulgence. 26 You blind Pharisee! First clean the inside of the cup and the plate, that the outside also may be clean. <br />27 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs, which outwardly appear beautiful, but within are full of dead people’s bones and all uncleanness. 28 So you also outwardly appear righteous to others, but within you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness. <br />29 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you build the tombs of the prophets and decorate the monuments of the righteous, 30 saying, ‘If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have taken part with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’ 31 Thus you witness against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. 32 Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers. 33 You serpents, you brood of vipers, how are you to escape being sentenced to hell? 34 Therefore I send you prophets and wise men and scribes, some of whom you will kill and crucify, and some you will flog in your synagogues and persecute from town to town, 35 so that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of innocent Abel to the blood of Zechariah the son of Barachiah, whom you murdered between the sanctuary and the altar. 36 Truly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.Steve Sampleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07917007249663358371noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-72752050390564286732011-07-11T22:52:16.783-04:002011-07-11T22:52:16.783-04:00There is very little good fruit in this blog. If I...There is very little good fruit in this blog. If I had a tree that produced this kind of fruit I would cut it down and use it for firewood!!!Steve Sampleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07917007249663358371noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-60726218865309508662011-07-11T21:07:38.090-04:002011-07-11T21:07:38.090-04:00I believe when we are at the judgement seat of Chr...I believe when we are at the judgement seat of Christ we will witness Ergun Caner recieve many crowns to lay at the feet of Jesus.He has done and continues to do much work for the Kingdom!! Yes,I believe he sinned, but we have a mediator that died for that sin. Based on the looks of this blog many in here are likely to be mere spectators at the judgement seat of Christ sitting on their thumbs watching Ergun go forward to recieve his crowns for all of the work he has done for the kingdom. I've heard his gospel presentation and I witnessed people get saved and that's what I went for. I didn't go to hear the story of his life. If you are more offended at the personl autobiogrophy he gave of himself than you are grateful of his gospel presentation that Christ died for our sins, was buried and raised on the thrid day then maybe you went to listen to him for the wrong reasons?Steve Sampleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07917007249663358371noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-51384645385207024272011-07-11T20:30:54.317-04:002011-07-11T20:30:54.317-04:00First let me say I am a supporter of Ergun Caner. ...First let me say I am a supporter of Ergun Caner. However, I do believe the evidence shows he did embellish on his testimony, but it is not mine or anybody elses place to convict him. He is the Lords servant not ours and it is His place to convict him and He does not need our help. I think the Lord has done that and Ergun's embellishment was exposed. I think the greatest atrocity is how the body of Christ is publicly divided over the matter. As far as Ergun going to a smaller school let me say that in April 2008 Ergun came and spent a weekend preaching at the church I attend with a membership of only about 300 people in a town with a population of only 900. I am certain he could have found a bigger engagemnet that weekend had that been his desire but he chose to do his work in my small church. Yes, the testimony he gave at my church was not in alignment with the facts of his history when they came out, however he did preach the gospel message that Christ died for our sins, was buried and on the third day rose from the dead and people got saved. The Holy Spirit used him and has used throughout his ministry, so why are others so quick to throw himunder the bus? If he repents and no longer embellishes I am confident the Lord will continue to use him. I would encourage everybody to just chill, set back and let us watch what the Lord is going to do. If the Lord uses him then that is our assurance that the Lord has forgiven him and therefore we should to. He messed up indeed as we all have. Maybe he could have handled it better, but let us see what the Lord does. Give this man a chance to do right from here on out. He has always made an awesome presentation of the gospel message of our Lord and the Lord has used him in big ways. His embellishments were exposed, he was stripped naked in front of all of us to see. Let's not mock him, but rather let's him him get re-clothed so he can go on about doing the business the Lord has called him to do. Again, the greatest atrocity is the division in the body of Christ over this. He opened the wound, but you won't let it heal. God Bless you Ergun Caner I wish you well my (not yet perfect)brother in Christ!! We are all who are saved going to be perfect one day, but we are not today. I seriously doubt that Erguns mistake is any greater than many of ours, only he is on a bigger stage that everybody saw his mistake. Let us not be Christian Pharisee's and place a yoak on him that the Lord does not intend him to carry. If the Lord has a yoak let the Lord put it on Him if He chooses.Steve Sampleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07917007249663358371noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-18962716805129030592011-07-03T02:02:43.324-04:002011-07-03T02:02:43.324-04:00http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYSLJ2oeebY&fea...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYSLJ2oeebY&feature=relatedAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-20593699788977149372011-06-22T20:55:20.983-04:002011-06-22T20:55:20.983-04:00Wow! I was doing some web surfing and just came ac...Wow! I was doing some web surfing and just came across this. I am a Bible believing Christian and find this to be simply amazing. I’d bet that if a non-believer was to come across this, they’d find it much more entertaining than the Protestants versus the Catholics. I’m glad you folks are working so hard to further the Kingdom. Is this what He’s called you to do?<br /><br />As to my personal opinion of the situation, I think that the watchdog has an incredible desire to poke out his fellow sinners eye as a way to assure that the speck is removed, but he’s having problems with the beam in his own eye. I realize that we’re called to be discerning, and to hold those in positions of authority to a higher standard, however I believe that you folks have totally gone way above & beyond the call of duty.<br /><br />I don’t intend to get into a back and forth with you folks, as I don’t have a college edjamacashun, and I learned a long time ago that you intellectually superior folks would just eat me alive (in Christian love, of course!). So please don’t point out my grammatical errors as I probably wouldn’t understand.<br /><br />While having doubts about one’s faith, it’s folks like you that create more confusion and disillusionment. Thanks for pushing me closer to the edge. And if perchance my words don’t betray my thoughts – I make this posting in anger. I truly hope that you can get the big sticks out of your own eyes someday!MikeRnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-27327048136934370662011-06-20T20:02:45.088-04:002011-06-20T20:02:45.088-04:00I have lived in Arlington most of my life and most...I have lived in Arlington most of my life and most of the churches I have been a member of have been affiliated with ABC in some way. I have known people that have attended and graduated from ABC. I have known and now know people that are on staff at ABC. My dad was saved under the preaching of a former President of ABC<br /><br />I did not attend ABC nor would I allow my kids to attend. ABC is in threat of losing its accreditation and anyone who says otherwise just simply doesn’t know the facts or willingly turns a blind eye. ABC has been on the verge of bankruptcy for as long as I can remember. I believe they have shown a very small profit once in the last five years. Their current finance guy has no experience or education with finances. Staff members have routinely been paid late, because the school didn’t have the money to make payroll. They are, in short, a mess.<br /><br />“Dr.” Moody pastored a church in Arlington who’s back door was as healthy as its front. I have seen him to be a man lacking in character, so to hire someone like Ergun, to be quite honest, just makes sense to me. They deserve each other.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-73255819043829302162011-05-27T20:17:10.004-04:002011-05-27T20:17:10.004-04:00Pay no attention to Cindy Capps. She has been blin...Pay no attention to Cindy Capps. She has been blindly defending Caner for a year now. <br /><br />"YOU are the ones funneling lies about this man without knowing exactly what you are talking about."<br /><br />Right Cindy. We don't know what we are talking about. When Ergun told the Marines his father had more than 1 wife at a time - specifically that he had 3 wives at the same time - we don't know what we are talking about. <br /><br />Go back to Sweet Frog, have a yogurt, and stop defending the indefensible.Pity for Cindyhttp://twitter.com/#!/cindybcappsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-2476709824835177472011-05-26T06:17:33.746-04:002011-05-26T06:17:33.746-04:00Cindy, it is a matter of record that Caner took ad...Cindy, it is a matter of record that Caner took advantage of one of the greatest tragedies in the history of this country, and LIED THROUGH HIS TEETH for TEN YEARS to personally profit from a situation that killed thousands of people. <br /><br />Ergun Caner is a despicable human being. But I don't know what is more pathetic; he, or dupes like yourself who continue to defend this creature.The Other Tomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-21613167019908325692011-05-26T01:21:13.977-04:002011-05-26T01:21:13.977-04:00Good riddance. The man was a charlatan and a patho...Good riddance. The man was a charlatan and a pathological liar. I am so glad Liberty decided to fire him instead of keeping him there and drinking his kool-aid. If only the first baptist jax members would wake up and kick Mac out. That would be the day.Anon Emushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15039491867869354754noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-20267015382560314942011-05-25T22:28:58.981-04:002011-05-25T22:28:58.981-04:00I am personal friends with the Caner family. Your ...I am personal friends with the Caner family. Your ignorance of the REAL situation & details and your rapid run to judgement glare brightly against someone you yourself accuse of lying. Hold your stones. YOU are the ones funneling lies about this man without knowing exactly what you are talking about. Congrats to Ergun & family and ABC. Our loss is your gain.Cindynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-47765655248832948962011-05-23T22:58:05.034-04:002011-05-23T22:58:05.034-04:00There is no "If" about it.
And an "...There is no "If" about it.<br /><br />And an "apology" is not Biblical repentance. If he had true Biblical repentance, Caner would sit down, shut up, and NEVER allow himself to be seen in any sort of leadership position in the church, EVER.The Other Tomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-80975085434788957192011-05-23T22:44:43.145-04:002011-05-23T22:44:43.145-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.joshuahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04851259684904185567noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-75716070368174991162011-05-23T21:41:59.085-04:002011-05-23T21:41:59.085-04:00"Great men of God" do NOT engage in a ne..."Great men of God" do NOT engage in a near decade-long campaign of lies, deceit, and fraud so as to totally recreate their life's story.<br /><br />And so long as this blight upon the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ remains in any public role within Christian circles, those of us who are faithful to Scripture have a duty before God to oppose this charlatin until such time as he offers proper biblical repentance for his sins.The Other Tomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-72224656228511543252011-05-23T20:43:17.405-04:002011-05-23T20:43:17.405-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.joshuahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04851259684904185567noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-5397639165610554582011-05-23T19:52:12.218-04:002011-05-23T19:52:12.218-04:00A couple things come immediately to mind
1 it is...A couple things come immediately to mind <br /><br />1 it is true that Dr Caner has not learned anything during this embarrassing ordeal. But what is truly da is that the Leadership at Liberty haven't either. Dr Falwell Jr apparently still wants Mr Caner around. Oh how the mighty have fallen as I think many would agree that Dr Falwell Sr would not have tolerated such lack of integrity. <br /><br />2. Neither Liberty University not Thomas Road Church are SBC. They may want to be but not yet. Originally both were part of the Baptist Bible Fellowship headquartered in Springfield, MO. It was and is a very strict, fundamentalist, independent Baptist group. I grew up in a couple of these churches and they make the Pharisees legalism look like rampant out of control libertine-ism. I am sure that the move at TRC and LU indicate a move away from that but SBC they are not and I hope that the Virginia State Convention does not soon admit them in large part due to this fiasco. <br /><br />Shame on those at LU who still want him there. It had become a fine institution. I had considered attending- being military Thierry distance Ed program is very attractive but I would rather pay more at another school than have a degree tainted by such scandal. <br /><br />I pry for Dr Caner's, Dr Falwell Jr and the Trustees repentance of thier arrogance and lack of integrity.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-79881086479030562652011-05-23T19:05:16.596-04:002011-05-23T19:05:16.596-04:00Jon Estes - I DID email Ergun Caner privately firs...Jon Estes - I DID email Ergun Caner privately first. I respectfully asked him about the discrepancies I had seen when this came to light in early 2010. <br /><br />He never responded to me. <br /><br />I sent the email to his LU email address as well as his erguncaner.com address. <br /><br />Nothing. <br /><br />I also respectfully emailed his pastor, Jonathan Falwell. <br /><br />He never responded either.<br /><br />When it became clear they were circling the wagons, only then did I decide to use a serrated edge.<br /><br />"...understood his intent on humor, his misspeak on dates, his poor pronunciation of some words, his confusion of events." Right Jon Estes, keep telling yourself that and maybe it will eventually become true. <br /><br />Telling people on multiple occasions that his father had multiple wives at the same time - that one lie alone - is enough to debunk your pathetic defense of him. And that lie is the tip of the iceberg.Dr Ergun Caner (satire)http://vimeo.com/16461368noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-8097366649586912272011-05-23T17:01:27.036-04:002011-05-23T17:01:27.036-04:00"Do you really believe the personal attacks a..."Do you really believe the personal attacks against Caner, though protected by free speech, are God honoring?"<br /><br />Yes, and according to I Corinthians 5 and Galatians 2, Biblically necessary.The Other Tomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-25617861557805006232011-05-23T16:01:15.590-04:002011-05-23T16:01:15.590-04:00The funny thing about this is Tim Lee doesn't ...The funny thing about this is Tim Lee doesn't even see how this blog post actually gave Liberty University some much needed credibility. <br /><br />Here is how it went down. <br /><br />Blog post states that Liberty University did something good and admirable. <br /><br />Time Lee says "No we didn't."Marcus Pittmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01218146136189467252noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-85346311743674105802011-05-23T15:38:03.955-04:002011-05-23T15:38:03.955-04:00"Jon, what country do you live in perhaps com..."Jon, what country do you live in perhaps communist Russia, your statement sure accounts for it. Our government was set up to rear the people of the land and now we the people fear government. Once we loose our voice people like you will ripen in your pride. We the people need more people like tom."<br /><br />Do you really believe the personal attacks against Caner, though protected by free speech, are God honoring?Jon L. Esteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13197096460227507823noreply@blogger.com