tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post1964608618224584314..comments2024-03-23T22:54:58.661-04:00Comments on FBC Jax Watchdogs: Ergun Caner Latest Sermon: Still Telling the Same Stories, Still Stretching the TruthFBC Jax Watchdoghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10740366031265491559noreply@blogger.comBlogger60125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-78936465096397555042011-09-20T10:37:59.742-04:002011-09-20T10:37:59.742-04:00Here is a link to a 'sermon' he 'preac...Here is a link to a 'sermon' he 'preached' on July 31, 2011. The topic of this talk is Ergun Caner, despite what the title would suggest.<br />http://canyoncreekbc.org/resources/online-media/audio-sermons/audio/13-the-samaritan-woman.htmlAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-45886875658548987692011-08-25T13:48:31.232-04:002011-08-25T13:48:31.232-04:00I knew Caner as an undergraduate at Cumberland Col...I knew Caner as an undergraduate at Cumberland College, KY. We knew him only as "Butch". I'm writing this because I was puzzled by his saying (as quoted on this webpage): "Do you know why you can understand me? Seventeen years ago, God got me married to a girl from Brookwood church."<br /><br />At Cumberland College, Butch spoke perfect, perfect English, without a smidgeon of any sort of accent. That was several years before he met his wife.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-67512295921999481142011-07-13T14:32:35.290-04:002011-07-13T14:32:35.290-04:00The sermon at http://brookwoodchurch.com/ isn'...The sermon at http://brookwoodchurch.com/ isn't there anymore.<br /><br />Since, many of you have downloaded/listened to it, could you post the MP3 somewhere?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-8507475862058939922011-07-02T17:39:18.212-04:002011-07-02T17:39:18.212-04:00I heard that Ergun Caner is preaching at Cross Chu...I heard that Ergun Caner is preaching at Cross Church, Ronnie Floyd's church in Arkansas, sometime in July. I don't know why these pastors invite charlatans like Caner to preach behind their pulpits. It's a disgrace. I guess Caner's message of fearing and hating Islam is too important to these pastors, even if it is filled with falsehoods. They know that gullible, uninformed Christians will eat up anything Caner says. These days, it seems the truth doesn't really matter anymore, even behind the pulpit.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-35728740258712056812011-07-02T11:09:13.037-04:002011-07-02T11:09:13.037-04:00Strictly speaking Caner was a Turkish citizen by b...Strictly speaking Caner was a Turkish citizen by birth (Turkey considers anyone Turkish if a parent, particularly a father, was Turkish; he was not Swedish despite being born there and having a mother who was Swedish though if he were raised there he could have claimed it). He might have lost Turkish citizenship upon becoming a US citizen (I believe Turkish law has changed over the years in this regards); however, if he did not, his children are also Turkish as well as US. However that is a bit like being Irish because one grandparent was Irish (legally correct but not necessarily culturally correct). <br /><br />From the available evidence, culturally he had some Turkish influence but probably more Swedish/American given that he was mostly raised by his mother and maternal grandmother and in the US though that might depend on how close he was to his father when growing up.Erpnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-14382576307010029372011-07-01T21:56:38.747-04:002011-07-01T21:56:38.747-04:00Fighting for the Faith: Dr. Ergun Caner (aka Echme...Fighting for the Faith: <a href="http://www.fightingforthefaith.com/2011/06/dr-ergun-caner-echmed-the-fake-terrorist-reemerges.html" rel="nofollow">Dr. Ergun Caner (aka Echmed the Fake Terrorist) Reemerges</a><br /><br />Starting just after the 17 minute mark. Please, no laughing, it’s serious business.....<br /><br />Actually, it is very sad.Douglashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14487653939801553210noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-54131823540958756202011-07-01T15:18:57.458-04:002011-07-01T15:18:57.458-04:00The NJ appearances are by way of DVD:
Len Ferm wi...The NJ appearances are by way of DVD:<br /><br />Len Ferm will be leading the presentation of this DVD series on apologetics from Veritas Evangelical Seminary. The series is based on 1 Peter 3:15: "Sanctify the Lord God in your hearts, and always be ready to give a defense (apologetic) to everyone who asks you a reason for the hope that is in you, with meekness and fear." One lesson will be presented each week followed by a time of discussion. Everyone is welcome to attend. For more information, please contact the church office (732-739-1282).<br /><br />Course Schedule:<br /><br />July 5: Norman Geisler - Responding to Relativism-The Case for Absolutes<br />July 12: Gary Habermas - Reliability of the Gospels<br />July 19: Steven Collins - Archeology Confirms the Reality of the Bible<br />July 26: William Dembski - Scientific Case for Intelligent Design<br />Aug 2: Gary Habermas - The Case for the Resurrection of Christ<br />Aug 9: Ergun Caner - The Secret of Islam<br />Aug 16: Norman Geisler - If God, Why Evil?<br />Aug 23: Ergun Caner - Why I Am Not a Muslim<br />Aug 30: Ron Rhodes - 10 Keys to Answering Cultists at Your DoorAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-34460609878967063782011-07-01T12:06:32.598-04:002011-07-01T12:06:32.598-04:00Ergun Caner will be speaking twice in NJ in August...Ergun Caner will be speaking twice in NJ in August if anyone wants to go see if he's telling the same ol' stories:<br /><br />http://mbchazlet.org/events.shtmlAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-1828545854020872622011-07-01T10:41:55.500-04:002011-07-01T10:41:55.500-04:00Sharon...I loved #6..."At least I wasn't ...Sharon...I loved #6..."At least I wasn't caught dancing!"<br /><br />Which reminds me....I saw a dean of one of LU's VERY important schools dancing it up big time at a function. Heh hehAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-83456056872807470042011-07-01T10:20:14.452-04:002011-07-01T10:20:14.452-04:00Re the article on the Tennessee Temple president h...Re the article on the Tennessee Temple president having to resign-the comments are hilarious!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-26507402781361770972011-07-01T10:08:37.046-04:002011-07-01T10:08:37.046-04:00WD,
Yeah, I think that's a good comparison-Can...WD,<br />Yeah, I think that's a good comparison-Caner and the Borat character. Both are very entertaining.<br /><br />It's like Caner is in the entertainment branch of the Baptist world. There are plenty of powerful men in that world, but they took different routes to obtain that power. Maybe if he was promoted as a Christian entertainer instead of a preacher. What do they call him, anyway? I guess he's not really a pastor, since he doesn't have a church. Do they call him an evangelist?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-80821603203814708482011-07-01T09:54:46.389-04:002011-07-01T09:54:46.389-04:00Did anyone see this? Sent it to Tom but not sure ...Did anyone see this? Sent it to Tom but not sure if he's seen it yet. The guy who was dean of LU's seminary right before Ergun Caner has been forced to step down from the presidency of Tennessee Temple because of plagiarism. (the book was written 15 years ago and actually was used as a textbook at LU according to some)<br /><br /><br /><a href="http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2011/jun/24/university-president-admits-plagiarism/" rel="nofollow">Former LU Seminary Dean forced to resign from Presidency at Tennessee Temple</a>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-21717308327696194902011-07-01T09:25:46.807-04:002011-07-01T09:25:46.807-04:00Sharon - I liken "Ergun Mehmet Giovanni Janel...Sharon - I liken "Ergun Mehmet Giovanni Janel" (Caner's name he used when preaching at FBCJ after 9/11), the former terrorist personna that led to his books and speaking tour, to the characters of Sacha Baren Cohen. Cohen made a movie called "Borat", and made an entire movie from a fictional character he created and portrayed. I remember he stayed in that personna for a long, long time. Even when the movie was out, his appearances on Leno and O'Brian's show were made "in character".<br /><br />That is what congregations on his speaking tour get - a real life Borat.<br /><br />And the kiddos at FBCJ will have a blast. Caner will talk about being persecuted, and will drum up the "Turkish, Muslim, immigrant" line, talk about his "hot wife", his "half breed kids", etc. And a good time will be had by all.FBC Jax Watchdoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10740366031265491559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-34142507844982461992011-07-01T09:18:42.173-04:002011-07-01T09:18:42.173-04:00"I am so glad I am not a member within the Ba..."I am so glad I am not a member within the Baptist denomination any longer.<br /><br />Leaving was so refreshing.<br /><br />Hope every one enjoys the Baptist ride.<br /><br />I am not smarter than most of those who listen to all those within the Baptist Mafia, I just have some " good ole' God given - common sense." <br /><br />Need I say more?"<br /><br />I, too, am a former Baptist. I think there are a lot of us out there. We should form a club. Actually there are already ex-fundie support groups.<br /><br />Anyway, I think what makes Baptist World so much like a soap-opera is that it's always been about personalities. It's all about preachers up there behind the pulpit screaming and stomping around and telling you you're all going to hell! So preachers who are good at drama and big on the power trip of it all get lots of followers (groupies?)<br /><br />I think "healtheland" made some great comments also. Just like with politicians, if you started strictly fact-checking sermons, a lot of preachers would be embarrassed-not all. But that's not quite the same thing as purposely misrepresenting where you were born and where you grew up. I don't know of any preachers who do that. <br /><br />Caner seems to have created a persona and wants to keep presenting that persona. It's sorta like Stephen Colbert-he's "in character." Except with Colbert, we KNOW he's doing this. We KNOW he's just entertaining us.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-42737632255763432572011-07-01T09:12:42.094-04:002011-07-01T09:12:42.094-04:00Thy Peace - good observations.
I thought the serm...Thy Peace - good observations.<br /><br />I thought the sermon fell absolutely flat. There was hardly any laughter at his jokes, scant applause when he was done. It was either a VERY small congregation, or his sermon was not received well or both.<br /><br />The sermon itself, was more about him and his family and his background and his jokes, than about the lesson in the bible. It was the worst sermon I've heard him deliver. He preached from Acts, and the going back and forth between the bible and using his family as examples was ridiculous. It was obvious that the point of his sermon was HIM and not the bible lesson. He was interested in convincing them them that indeed he is "Turkish, Muslim, Immigrant", and that he never lied.<br /><br />I've compared Caner's style to that of Perry Noble. Perry's favorite topic in his sermon is Perry, and Perry's wife and kids. So it is with Caner.<br /><br />I could also do without Caner describing his wife as "hot", and drawing out the "h"..."hhhhhhhot". Why do the rock star preachers want to tell people how "hot" their wives are? Noble does it, Caner does it, Furtick does it. What public figures EVER brag about how "hot" their wife is? Why is Wade not telling his congregation how "hot" his wife is?? Because Wade is a mature, serious man. Caner and Noble and Furtick, well, not so much. <br /><br />And to make it all worse, Brunson on June 29th tweeted the following:<br /><br />"@erguncaner for so they persecuted the prophets. Your in real good company. Be of good cheer."<br /><br />Funny, I thought the OT prophets were persecuted for telling the TRUTH, not for lying. How twisted.<br /><br />Brunson is an enabler of Caner, to the detriment of the youth at FBC Jax.<br /><br />Used to be that the pastor of FBC Jax guarded the flock as best they could from the likes of Caner...sure is a different day.FBC Jax Watchdoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10740366031265491559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-74940854968769312492011-07-01T08:46:51.818-04:002011-07-01T08:46:51.818-04:00I heard the entire Brookwood sermon last night.
1...I heard the entire Brookwood sermon last night.<br /><br />1. Caner is doing 11 (Eleven) Summer Camps this summer.<br /><br />2. Caner appears to be doing well for his speaking gigs.<br /><br />3. After listening to his Brookwood sermon, I personally would pay Caner NOT to preach Brookwood sermon any where or any sermons similar to this.<br /><br />4. I truly felt bad for the listeners of Brookwood sermon.Rameshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09728392311602332613noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-15290669257659461152011-07-01T07:58:28.835-04:002011-07-01T07:58:28.835-04:00'This guy is the DEVIL in the flesh. He ought ...'This guy is the DEVIL in the flesh. He ought to be arrested, flogged, whipped, mocked, scourged, deprived of food and water for days, spit upon and more.'<br /><br />Do you really believe all of this?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-60210576775487039152011-06-30T21:42:41.532-04:002011-06-30T21:42:41.532-04:00It seems that Ergn, a.k.a "Butch" believ...It seems that Ergn, a.k.a "Butch" believes that this Jesus we are proclaiming just has to have some public relations help. Obviously, we have reached a new era in which showmanship and smoke and mirrors is the new norm for reaching the lost. Standing before an audience and opening your Bible and telling the Good News must be passe....We are fooled and fooled again by people who enlighten us.....and the only reason they can is because we have been complacent in knowing the Bible. I long for a time when you can depend on a church's biblical teaching....not sermons on touchy/feely, not 20 minutes of musical banality....just the Word. I am too distrustful now of any man who stands as the Shepherd of His Flock....I am saddened, but I stand on the Rock that is Christ Jesus....Butch will be better served to remember that Jesus needs no grease paint and joking on his behalf.hopeandfaithnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-33241211075815985972011-06-30T21:30:48.899-04:002011-06-30T21:30:48.899-04:00I am so glad I am not a member within the Baptist ...I am so glad I am not a member within the Baptist denomination any longer.<br /><br />Leaving was so refreshing.<br /><br />Hope every one enjoys the Baptist ride.<br /><br /> I am not smarter than most of those who listen to all those within the Baptist Mafia, I just have some " good ole' God given - common sense." <br /><br />Need I say more?Ga Bloggernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-91525573263405638132011-06-30T21:00:06.507-04:002011-06-30T21:00:06.507-04:00maybe he believes his own hype . . . in that case,...maybe he believes his own hype . . . in that case, God help him <br /><br />if not, he is a liar and an opportunist . . . <br />and in that case, God help the ChurchAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-20721064854656343942011-06-30T18:45:22.959-04:002011-06-30T18:45:22.959-04:00"Any parent of FBC JAX that lets their kid go..."Any parent of FBC JAX that lets their kid go to youth camp with Caner as camp preacher ought to be examined by a psychiatirst!. I would not let mine go -- not in a million years...NOT EVER!!"<br /><br />If everyone feels so strongly, why not go and publicly picket the camp instead of just venting in the blogosphere. <br /><br />I think that would be more effective, especially if the media was alerted to the ruckus.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-52696160023326660502011-06-30T18:33:56.961-04:002011-06-30T18:33:56.961-04:00This guy is the DEVIL in the flesh. He ought to b...This guy is the DEVIL in the flesh. He ought to be arrested, flogged, whipped, mocked, scourged, deprived of food and water for days, spit upon and more. <br /><br />He ought to have all the money taken back from him that he has made preaching in churches and camps the past ten years WHY? To show him you cannot and should not lie, cheat, steal, mislead, and mock God's name. He has made a very nice and high-income living at the hands of other Believers. He is a modern day "snake oil salesman," and any person or preacher (BRUNSON inlcluded) who helps him promote his pack of lies, ought to be whipped right along with him. That's my take... wanna know how I really feel? I'll tell you if you want to know! The Bible says there will be wolves in Sheep's clothing, and CANER is one of the biggest out there! Turn or BURN CANER!! Now or never! <br /><br />Any parent of FBC JAX that lets their kid go to youth camp with Caner as camp preacher ought to be examined by a psychiatirst!. I would not let mine go -- not in a million years...NOT EVER!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-76800537197090895382011-06-30T18:00:28.722-04:002011-06-30T18:00:28.722-04:00No, Turks are not Arabs. Though I assume their cl...No, Turks are not Arabs. Though I assume their close proximity to the Arab world means that there must be some racial overlap. This is where we get into Caner saying that he didn't mean to leave this impression. He seemed to identify closely with Arab Muslims in his sermons. Lebanon and Egypt are both largely Arabic countries. All of the 9/11 hijackers were Arab. He seemed to imply that there was a close alignment in the 1960-70s between Arab Muslim terrorists and Turkish Muslims.Moses Modelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16027355755303728808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-46248382124919435982011-06-30T17:32:26.433-04:002011-06-30T17:32:26.433-04:00I believe Mark Twain's books are found in the ...I believe Mark Twain's books are found in the fiction section of the library.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8384632623933772727.post-88261810063525307182011-06-30T16:32:50.950-04:002011-06-30T16:32:50.950-04:00The problem is that what Ergun Caner is doing is n...The problem is that what Ergun Caner is doing is no different from what a lot of preachers who rely heavily on biography and narrative do. The homiletical scene is FULL of people who rely on half-truths, distortions, exaggerations, inventions and outright fabrications, and has been for quite some time. Lots of folk know that if always telling the truth about events and personalities were a requirement for the position, there would be a lot of empty pulpits and pastor-less churches. <br /><br />In light of this, Caner and his supporters are taking the position that he is being singled out for doing basically what lots of other preachers do, and that his being singled out is mostly due to the improper motives of his accusers. They are taking the position: why go after Caner and not everybody else? Why is everyone else allowed to spout "factual statements that are self-contradictory" and given "pulpit license" except Caner? Why is Caner being held to a higher standard than so many other evangelical and fundamentalist preachers, including those whom Caner himself learned from and emulated?<br /><br />Of course, these folks are being disingenuous as to how "Butch Caner" was transformed into "Ergun Mehmet Caner." You see, prior to September 11th, having a Muslim/Arab (though are Turks actually Arab? ah what does it matter) background was actually a hindrance in the circles that Caner was teaching and pastoring, so it was in his interests to be as "American" as possible in a lot of places that were still coming to grips with the whole "integration" thing and what not. It was only after September 11th that being an Arab ex-Muslim became a positive instead of a negative, and being a former terrorist trainee who was an expert on the Muslim religion and culture was more to it.<br /><br />So, while "tall tales" and "fishing stories" are regrettably common in the pulpit, Caner's going from "Butch Caner" to "Ergun Mehmet Caner" exceeds even the exaggerations and lies that are "normal" for the pulpit. The problem is that the personalities and institutions that accepted and embraced the small liars yesterday and will again tomorrow aren't going to be very likely to oppose a big liar today.healthelandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02597322285407724205noreply@blogger.com