Yesterday, Trey Brunson, Director of Special Projects at FBC Jax, was named to the Florida Baptist State Convention "Imagine If Great Commission Task Force", by FBSC president John Cross. Trey is one of 30 people selected from around the state who will study what changes need to be made in this state convention to more effectively reach the people of Florida with the gospel.
I do not mean this post to be disrespectful to Trey in any way. I have never heard a negative comment about Trey, and I'm sure he is a capable, fine young man.
However, his appointment to the Task Force is perhaps an example of why an amendment was put forth to the Florida GCR Task Force motion yesterday requiring the task force members to be selected by committee, not by John Cross, FSBC President, in consultation with John Sullivan FSBC Executive Director. That amendment was soundly defeated, and Cross selected the committee.
Trey has been in Florida for only about 3 1/2 years, serving in a position at FBC Jax as the Special Projects Director, although we can't be positive since he has never been listed on the church website as an official staff member. One might wonder what qualifications he has that would make him a candidate for such an appointment in this state, and if his relationship to his father had anything to do with him getting appointed. No doubt John Cross wants the younger generation of Florida Baptists to be represented on the task force, which Trey most certainly is, but if someone is going to represent the Jacksonville area or even FBC Jax, why not one of the OTHER younger ministers in this area like Dan Elkins, or Chris Eppling, or Marcus Allen, Jr. who have all lived and served and ministered in the state of Florida for a much longer time.
I would provide a hyperlink to Trey's bio, or his email address, or description of his ministry at FBC Jax, but he still is not anywhere listed on the FBC Jax website as a staff member. Maybe with this appointment that will change.
But congrats to Trey for such an important appointment, and we wish him well as he serves on this important committee in our state of Florida.
I don't know anything about the Florida GCR Task Force. Are all of the states doing this? I don't know if our state is.
ReplyDeleteYou raise some very good questions. It seems to me that the best way to have the recommendations of a task force well received it is to have well known, experienced and respected people on the task force AND for the task force to make good, common sense recommendations.
Youth is not an automatic disqualifier, but youth combined with lack of experience in ministry and the state does not make this a strong pick.
If the task force is large, maybe one lesser pick won't be as noticeable.
I wish you guys in Florida well.
Louis
The vote that you refer to in Fl. was simple. It was a vote deciding between "consolodated control" or "trust the people." The SBC example was followed and now Fl will endure unneeded strife and more political control. One of the main arguments used in favor of one-man control was something that we have heard a lot lately shouted to the halls of the US Congress. "Trust us and hurry-up and do it now." They did.
ReplyDeleteI also have no criticism of Trey personally. Let's all keep it that way. However, once again, it seems that the family branding and self-promotion of the Brunson family has reared its ugly head. While dad is flying all over the country for speaking engagements, mom is an IMB trustee, and now "the third" is serving in a Statewide position. All three of these folks are allegedly drawing salary and benefits from the tithes and offerings to minister at FBC Jacksonville. Yet they seem to be pursuing other interests on "company time" so to speak.
ReplyDeleteNow, we get "less" Mac, "less" Deb, and "less" Trey for the money.
And why have anyone from FBC Jax on the committee. We all know they have no insights into reaching the lost. They pay Maurilio to handle all that. I don't think OT history, and angry abusive preaching, and deacon's resolutions are the way to reach the next generation. I hope Trey will agree and not try and get others to follow his own dad's example.
The great commission started by the Lord was two people going out to win a lost person/s and giving them the plan of salvation. It worked 2000 years ago and has down through the ages. Anything else is human engineering and man made and we all know that pales in comparison to what Jesus taught.
ReplyDeleteIt also is given to us Gentiles by the apostle Paul in his epistles. Grace grace and more grace without works.
You talk about best practices, cutting edge, etc, etc, just do what worked and quit trying to improve on what works!!!!
November 11, 2009 1:42 PM - I agree with you. Problem is, what "works" won't support a satellite, and a school, and $18 million dollar budget. So they must engage in secular marketing, growing their "market share" by sheep stealing, and branding of celebrity pastors to keep bringing in those millions. The Bible applies to "churches." These multi-million dollar enterprises are NOT churches. So they are wise to not try and sustain themselves by acting Biblically.
ReplyDeleteBut yet they must keep acting as if they care about reaching the lost, helping the poor, etc., because that is what the kool-aid drinkers that give the millions need to hear to feel good about themselves. They don't mind giving $500,000 to Mac, as long as they hear him say he gave $50.00 to a poor person once. Sheesh.
He is what? 20?
ReplyDeleteI am sure there are no seasoned Christians in Fla who have been slaving away for the Association who were qualified for the task force.
I know how it goes. In my state the committees were stacked with wives, daughter in laws, etc of the big wigs. Some were not even 24!
I do not see anything wrong with this. I don't see anyone creating a dynasty or something. I don't see a lot of people clamouring for the appointment either.
ReplyDeleteWD you just continue to try and stir up trouble. There is no there there. Just leave them alone.
The truth of the matter is that you have become pretty insignificant. Your last two posts remind me of the "I am not touching you" game.
"Oh, there is nothing libelous of this post. I am just printing the facts." How juvinile and how nasty of you. Only a coward would pick on someones children.
You should just try to mind your own business.
Hey Anon 8:32 pm
ReplyDeleteThe kid is on the church payroll without a job description. That means that the Dad has put him in the light and made him a possible target. And then this faux appointment comes along. What do you expect, everyone to applaud?
The tone of your comments is so ardently cynical, despite your tepid efforts to conceal it, that it reeks of rhetorical impotence. I'm sympathetic to your cause but, frankly, you often come across as disingenuous and inept. I think you need to get another life.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.linkedin.com/pub/trey-brunson/7/385/420
ReplyDeleteThe appointment of this young man says blatantly that the powers in Fl and at the SBC highest level are backing Mac all the way and that they don't care who knows it.
ReplyDeleteIt also says to Tom that "You can't stop us."
With some of the leading pastors in Fl standing and urging to have the appointments by one man go through probably indicates that they knew who was on the list. It may even mean that they helped make the list.
It is a flaunting of arrogence and an inditement of current FlBC leadership.
Anon 8:32
ReplyDeleteI don't see a lot of people clamouring for the appointment either.
================
And I don't see people clamouring to fill up the "empty" pews of FBC Jax that has been left with the appointment of the "Brunson Family & Friends."
You say "only a coward would pick on someones children" . . .Trey's a young adult who was hired by his father to be an employee of the FBC Jax. I don't see WD announcement as "picking on someones kid".
Anon 10:32 . .At least WD provides post's that gives information that we members of FBC Jax are never informed about, but that's probably because we lack a full time pastor.
The tone of your comments is likewise ardently cynical.
This author below hit the target as to why members are leaving, not because of so called cynical remarks on a blog.
"While dad is flying all over the country for speaking engagements, mom is an IMB trustee, and now "the third" is serving in a Statewide position. All three of these folks are allegedly drawing salary and benefits from the tithes and offerings to minister at FBC Jacksonville. Yet they seem to be pursuing other interests on "company time" so to speak.
Arce -
ReplyDeleteHow do you know who is on the payroll?
Besides, there are many good men that got their start where there dad's work. So what! I think it is great that there is a new generation willing to carry the Christian banner.
To my knowledge there are very few people that know anything about what anyone gets paid.
Either you are a bonafide liar, a very good guesser, or you are very close to the source.
So which are you?
The Brunsons are using FBC Jax as a stepping stone.
ReplyDeleteExcuse me as I take your money and further my career, status and ability to take money from others.
Be a good Christian now, and keep your mouth shut. Remember also, you must thithe.
Why are these people relevant? They are only "important" in their own eyes and in the eyes of fellow "club members". It's a business using the name of Jesus Christ to pretend they are doing Gods work. The fact that "some" people want to continue to PAY them for this is beyond me. This church ceased to be RELEVANT when Dr. Lindsay died. It's just that simple. In my opinion Jesus was asked to take a seat while others took the stage.
ReplyDeleteIt's all about power and control. Has been forever, and will continue to be. If Southern Baptists can't figure out how to follow the Great Commission without a blue-ribbon committee, you've got bigger problems than any committee can solve.
ReplyDeleteI have read every single blog post and comment since the beginning and finally feel like I should comment. Sorry for the long post, but here it is:
ReplyDeleteActually, I would have to partially agree with Mr. Rich. I do not know much about Trey at all and while I was at FBC I often wondered what he was doing. However, I do not feel that NOT knowing what someone is doing is grounds for calling them unqualified. I arguably feel that a brighter spotlight should be on Trey due to his age/experience during his tenure, but before we rush into the whole "I don't know him so I don't know if he is qualified" ordeal, lets give it a couple months.
Also, I find it very comical how some speak of the church as "the powers" or some mystical conspiracy found in the latest video game. Really? I mean, there might be some things going on in the church that arent perfect (I am firm in my belief that both parties are at fault in the past incident) but knowing both the pastor and many of his staff AS WELL as being a friend of Mr. Rich, I feel that the conspiracy theories might have gone off the deep end. It is a church. It's not a secret club of assassins or a magical realm that only certain "believers" can see. It is a CHURCH. Whether you like the church or not it is a church. I promise, when you walk in you wont be frisked or asked to take a blue pill or a red pill (matrix), you will go into a (yes rather large) auditorium (sp?) sing hymns, listen to worship music and then hear a sermon. That's it! Yeah FBC is large. Yeah the staff is paid larger salaries than at a smaller church. But, "bringing the church back to its roots", in America's history, the pastor was given a share of the BEST of what his congregation could provide as gratitude for serving the lord. They did not have to, they wanted to. It was an act of worship by taking care of their shepherd. His house was provided, his food was provided, and limber was provided so his house as well as the Lord's house might have heat. Im not ashamed that FBC "takes care" of their staff. I hope that we can be such a thankful people for their ministry that we are willing to provide our pastor with our gifts. And don't worry, Im not getting paid by FBC, so Im not biased.
Also, so what if a dad promotes his son to others. If my dad didnt I would be rather embarrassed. I guarantee you that if your father was a strong foundation in your upbringing then he had something to do with helping you find a job at some point in your life.
But, getting back to my first point, if there is a negative comment towards you Mr. Rich, please do not react harshly. If a member of FBC made a comment about Tony not being qualified for something and that his success is only because of you, I would expect an aggressive rebuttal which is (IMO) justified. I love ya Mr. Rich! Hope the family is doing well!
P.S.- The reason for the Anon. post is not to hide my identity from Mr. Rich. I am not confident in the moral maturity of some recent posters and am not willing to enter into the "circle of drama" for either side due to my position in the church family.
Poster 12:25:...."Due to my position in the church family". Guess that explains it all. Wake up, you can't ride two horses at the same time. The "circle of Drama" is the loss of a vibrant church that once was a power house for the LORD JESUS CHRIST. Not just a footnote in church failures and church politics. I would argue "It is a church", with you any day of the week.
ReplyDeleteSurely everyone knows the way to fulfill the Great Commission is to build a bigger and better building!!! Ask FBC Dallas with their new $130 million program!
ReplyDeletehttp://phillellington.blogspot.com/2009/11/130-million-church.html
"How do you know who is on the payroll?"
ReplyDeleteAre you trying to imply that Trey is NOT on the payroll?
P.S.- The reason for the Anon. post is not to hide my identity from Mr. Rich. I am not confident in the moral maturity of some recent posters and am not willing to enter into the "circle of drama" for either side due to my position in the church family.
ReplyDeleteNovember 12, 2009 12:25 PM
Not impressed. Problem is, this is not GM or General Electric. They pretend to be a church. So, you think it is ok for daddy to give Junior a job instead of Jr going out and facing the real world to get some knocks and find out how to grow up.
What it is is dynasty building. You see it all the time. Little boys and girls who never grow up and mommy and daddy have to rescue them. Mega churches are great places for this and it is quite common for most of the family to be on the payroll. (Anyone rememberthe days the pastors wife taught SS and played the piano in worhsip for free? But now that ministry is a career choice for hirlings, those days are over. Now, they burden the church for money as Paul refused to do)
So now Trey will be a great minister to the masses because he understands the hard knocks of the real world? I think not. Therein is your problem. Nice try, though.
Wisdom is not real prevelant at FBCJax. Too busy with all the exciting goings ons.
Unbelievable. You would label your post as "Congrats to Trey Brunson" and then attack him for his tenure in Florida and his lack of appearance on a website.
ReplyDeleteWhy don't you post something about Trey's ministry to young singles, to surfers, to college students, to young ministers and to young men at FBC Jax. The reason you do not is because you lack the intellectual honesty to speak highly of anything that is Brunson.
I've read your postings, but this one might be the most indictative of your obsession with Mac Brunson's demise.
It's been said before, but get a life Thomas. Or at least invest yourself into the Kingdom that is unshakeable.
Shame on you.
http://www.crosstalkblog.com/2009/11/when-money-is-tight-churches-turn-to/
ReplyDeleteNovember 12, 2009 12:25 PM
ReplyDeleteit is interesting you say you have read "every single post and comment" and yet this is your first time to comment. Really? Why? You should know this is really just a side post, not relevant to any of the real main issues of this blog.
So Tom blogs about FBC Jax. Big deal. It is his right to do it, and to do it anonymously or under a pseudonym. What is not okay, is for the JSO and SAO to get involved with subpoenas to obtain federally protected privacy information. It is also not okay for the leaders of the church to call him a sociopath, mentally unstable, and a coward to a Times Union reporter. Then, when caught, they have lied to try and cover their actions, resulting in lawsuits. No apologies, no Matthew 18, no love, grace or kindness towards him or his wife.
And you pick this post to comment on? Nothing about the Pastor's guidebook saying not accept large gifts? Nothing about nepotism? Nothing about changed by-laws, or deacon's resolutions? Nothing about ministry budgets being cut while advertising budgets are being increased? No concerns about Maurilio?
But this one side article about Trey being appointed and you decide to make your first point. Really? And you decide to bring in the name of Tom's son while you are at it? Why? Is he on salary and benefits, paid from your donations? I think only salaried employees of the family have been reported on here. Or at least only those proclaimed from the pulpit by Mac.
Sorry, you are already in the "circle of drama" "friend of Mr. Rich." You just don't know it yet.
P.S.- The reason for the Anon. post is not to hide my identity from Mr. Rich. I am not confident in the moral maturity of some recent posters and am not willing to enter into the "circle of drama" for either side due to my position in the church family.
ReplyDeleteNovember 12, 2009 12:25 PM
___________________________________
I think this makes you a "coward" according to all the Mac and A.C. supporters. :)
"Why don't you post something about Trey's ministry to young singles, to surfers, to college students, to young ministers and to young men at FBC Jax. The reason you do not is because you lack the intellectual honesty to speak highly of anything that is Brunson."
ReplyDeleteWhat if the money gets tight and Trey has to go find a real job that is not so...uh..protected by daddykins?? He might have to learn how the REAL world works outside of mega ministry budgets.
Give us something to speak highly of. You want us to make stuff up? That is what Brunson does.
Time for you to get a clue.
Well this has been a joy to read. I would like to ask a question of the many bloggers on this site: Is there evidence of a living relationship with Christ in any one of these threads? Would a non-believer see Jesus in this? Not to go back to pre-school or anything, but my parents spoke about this blog and the attention it is getting in the Jax christian community...I am in high school right now, and i sure hope my mom or dad are not one of the commenters here. Prov. 15:1, Prov. 29:9, Prov. 10:14. ADULTS, please take a lesson from the wisest man who ever lived and refrain from being foolish.
ReplyDeleteWell this has been a joy to read. I would like to ask a question of the many bloggers on this site: Is there evidence of a living relationship with Christ in any one of these threads? Would a non-believer see Jesus in this?
ReplyDelete_________________________________
And I too asked myself the same question when I read the headlines of the Florida Times Union with the comments of the head pastor of First Baptist Church . . .again, when I read another newspaper article with the comments from Judge Soud . . .and last when I learned my church had banned an individual who had done no wrong from coming on to our church property.
This was and is a dark day for the reputation in the Christian community. No Joy!
The answer, sad to say is No, an unbeliever would not have read or saw the Love of Christ in the FTU reporters column. Your parents are to be commended for raising you - I was impressed with your thoughts and wish the leadership of FBC Jax had followed your wisdom.
As a non-believer, I feel qualified to answer this:
ReplyDelete"Would a non-believer see Jesus in this?"
Speaking for my unbelieving self, I don't come here to "see Jesus."
What I do see here are people looking for truth. In my little world, there's not much more important than truth. In fact, it may be the only thing that is really important.
I realize you're just a kid and don't really know much about how the world works, but a lot of folks have been totally hosed by people in church leadership positions. Those that have, find refuge and understanding here at Cousin Tom's blog. Try and put the shoe on the other foot, kid. It's a valuable lesson I learned early while on active duty.
Anon 11:36. Life is progressive. When you are young you tend to trust everyone. As you mature you quickly learn that is a mistake. There are a lot of people who could care less about you or me and they enjoy taking advantage of you when you are vulnerable. Thats why it is very important that you read and study your bible. The important things to have at your command are the helmet of salvation, the Word of God, and the other armments in order to quell the firey darts of the Devil. Never be afraid to give an account or testimony of your stand for Jesus Christ. You will be rewarded, maybe not while on earth, but you will be in heaven.
ReplyDeleteKnowing the truth is the most important issue you will ever learn. Take heart, you may even learn something on the internet that they do not teach you in church or school. You have a lot of learn and I pray you will experience a lot more Good than evil in this cruel and wicked world.
November 12, 2009 11:36 PM - thanks for your comment here. Whether I agree with your views or not, or agree with whether you should have remained anonymous in your statements here or not, I do realize that you have done nothing wrong by voicing your opinion here. Think about it. Your post is a microcosm of the entire blog in which you call foolish. You observed something you did not feel honored or showed Christ to a lost world. Your devotion to Christ caused you to blog about it. You chose to make your views known here and did so anonymously. Think about it. That is exactly what Tom did. So why would he be foolish and you are not? Why would you hope your parents don't post here when you just did?
ReplyDeleteWould you like to be trespassed and your family banned from the church for what you just did here? Should the JSO and SAO be used to find your identity, or your parents, if they commented here? Should you or they be called cowards, mentally unstable and sociopath's for commenting here anonymously like you just did?
Think about it. That is all Tom did. Yet what an unloving, un-Christian, un-Biblical, and maybe illegal response from the church about Tom's blog.
You see this blog is about one's right to criticize his church leadership. And about what price the powers that be in that church will try to exact from any dissenters. What efforts will they undergo to out and ban dissent? What measures will they take? What law enforcement agencies will they use?
Read and learn, young Christian, and don't miss the real issues.
"Well this has been a joy to read. I would like to ask a question of the many bloggers on this site: Is there evidence of a living relationship with Christ in any one of these threads? Would a non-believer see Jesus in this?"
ReplyDeleteYes. A unbeliever already thinks we are, for the most part, hypocrites. And with good reason. Over the last 20-30 years we have made a mockery of the Biblical Body of Christ.
When a non believer sees a Christian stand up, at great personal cost, and point out the evil in Christendom that presents itself as good, they are surprised and will many times ask about true Christianity.
I have experienced this very thing from unbelievers quite a few times.
Matt
Matt - you are correct. The non-Christians who are sincere about learning more about Christ, should be encouraged by a blog such as this. It shows that Christians are able to ask questions of leaders without being shunned and banned and defamed. Sure, FBC JAX did that to one dissenter, but due to this blog, the whole nation knows it was wrong. Brunson, Soud and Blount have been exposed.
ReplyDeleteNow, hopefully both Christians and non-Christians alike will be encouraged by Tom's willingness to expose the church's aggressive confrontational response to questions and criticism as being unacceptable.
Tom reminds me of John the Baptist...voice crying in the wilderness. Sad that we have few Toms today in our churches.
ReplyDelete"Why don't you post something about Trey's ministry to young singles, to surfers, to college students, to young ministers and to young men at FBC Jax."
ReplyDeleteIt appears Trey already did.
Surfing Pastor
Check out the Mac-approved Krispy Kreme and the no misfires pics while you're there. How old is this guy again?
Trey Bunson/Twitter & FBC Jax Staff
ReplyDeleteTrey has some maturing to do!
It is too bad that Trey cannot prove himself as his own man. His daddy's name will always follow him. I feel sorry for him as he will never know if he got the position because of his own talent and character or because of his daddy's name brand.
New BBC Open Forum,
ReplyDeleteThat sign is funny, but or course it is not hanging permanently on Trey's desk like you are insinuating.
The fact is, Trey ministers to people, to young people, to the unchurched. He disciples many young men in the church.
Would you be willing Mr BBC Open Forum to list the ministries that you do personally to reach the next generation of Believers? Would you tell all of us of the time you put into discipling people?
I, and perhaps others, would be very interested in your Kingdom work?
Oh please, NOT Dan Elkins.
ReplyDeleteAnyone but him.