Watch and listen to a brief prophetic word from Jerry Vines' final sermon at FBC Jax nearly 3 years ago to the day, back in February 2006...about the tragedy of the glory of God departing from a church or a pastor.
Jerry hit the nail on the head. Todays preachers are mostly interested in wealth, fame, and admiration. If they don't get it in one place, they will attempt to get it somewhere else. Its the primary reason churches are dying. The pastors do not have the touch of God on their ministry...and some never had it to begin with. Thats why membership is down, funding is down, and buildings are being sold or boarded up. But we live in this crazy get rich scheme era. Preachers think they should be "rewarded" like other CEO, To be honest its a good thing for some of these churches to close. Like the man said on an earlier post you will have to look for yourselves to find a good fundamentalist church where the preaching is strong, but the pastor is loving and humble. It can only get worse for most churches, as the pastors have bought into this lie of the Devil. They see other ego centered mega church pastors and they think they are just as good or better speakers and they go for the GOLD rather than GOD and HIS written WORD. God help us get over this mess of pottage.
Vines really hit on it. Whether Mac and those present applied the "obvious" word to themselves, who knows. Maybe this is why MA went to Chart House. Maybe he knew what was coming.
This clip is not from this year, but from THREE YEARS AGO. He preached this as Mac was sitting there, waiting in the wings for Vines to leave. Just a few weeks later we were introduced to "Team Brunson" and we all cried and voted "Aye" to call Mac and Debbie and Trey Brunson as our pastors.
Visit Maurilio's blog and you'll see an article he wrote about Linda and Harold McNeil.
Vines was 100% correct in this description of FBCJ today. And indeed what is happening in general to churches. But we must keep in mind that we are in the "Falling Away" of the church and in the last days of Bible prophecy! So we may expect what we are seeing. I would really hate to be one of the preachers of a church that is "falling away".
Vines preached this sermon in 2006, and STILL recommended Mac for this church? Sometimes departing preachers don't like successful preachers to follow them. Maybe this was such a case. Too many clues here. With Mac FBCJ was guaranteed to fail. Whatever, Vines's sermon was prophetic and accurate. Just my opinion.
Glad someone put the humanity back into thes "saintly" beings called preachers. In some cases, the former preachers want the incoming preachers to be a "problem" for the church, so the members will say, "Oh, if we just had so and so back". Referring to the former preacher. Warped, I know but, sometimes egos are so entrenched that it just happens. Not saying this is the case, but,I have seen it happen.
Maybe the reason the glory of the Lord departs from churches (on the whole) has to do more with what's going on (or not going on) in the pew, than what's going on (or not going on) in the pulpit! Just so you know, I've sat in the pew and preached in the pulpit, so I know both sides of the issue. It's easy to critize what you don't know or what you think you know!!!! Just a thought!!! Take it or leave it but in the end, God does the judging, we aren't that smart!
anon 1:13 - you are right, it could be what is going on in the pew. But when a new pastor comes in and immediately starts with the actions and behaviours documented on this blog, we can be reasonable certain it is the pastor in this case. Not those in the pew that continue to give and serve faithfully as they have done for over 60 years!!!!!
If you have not sat in the pews at FBCJ, you have no clue as to what has happened to the church. The pew sitters were "happy" and, yes gullible not knowing there were vultures such as Brunson coming into town to "take control" of their personalized kingdom.
Thank you anon. 3:l4 pm: Those of us who have been in the pew at FBCJ for years and years have a hard time, when being told by ignorant "late-comers" what the problems are. Watchdog has laid out the problems clearly on this blog. But just for the record; after Lindsay died, I was told from a good authority, that 2,000 people left under the Vines tenure. Vines was another one that did not take instruction well, especially if he didn't like you.
Vines and Johnny Hunt are good friends. Just look where Vines now attends church in Georgia, which is his home base.
Homer Lindsay kept things under control. His death opened the door for what is now in place; Vines set the stage. Yes he is an absolutely marvelous, expository preacher, but he know from whence the dollar cometh.
I believe today marks the 9th anniversary of Dr. Lindsay's passing. Little did we know then, that it was such a huge turning point for the church. If we knew what was in front of us, I wonder if we would not have chosen to just close the doors, rather than turn the (then) solid soul winning church into the mess it is today. My astonishment is how easily this has come about.
I will always be thankful to the Lord for allowing me the gift and the priviledge of being under the preaching of Dr. Lindsay. He taught me (simply) how to study my bible, how to witness, and how important these things were. He taught me that my life was not just mine. It belonged to the Lord, and what I did with it mattered. He also taught me how to treat others. I must confess I am still having trouble with how others treat me, including some preachers. But, God knows all, and I am responsible for me. After all, not all, including most preachers, had the gift of a Dr. Lindsay in their life. An additional blessing was his "perfect" partner in life and ministry "Ms. Shirley". Both of them really lived for Jesus. For them, many are grateful. How we miss them!
Anonymous comments are allowed, but troll-type comments, responses to trolls, and grossly off-topic comments will be subject to denial by the Watchdog.
Jerry hit the nail on the head. Todays preachers are mostly interested in wealth, fame, and admiration. If they don't get it in one place, they will attempt to get it somewhere else. Its the primary reason churches are dying. The pastors do not have the touch of God on their ministry...and some never had it to begin with. Thats why membership is down, funding is down, and buildings are being sold or boarded up. But we live in this crazy get rich scheme era. Preachers think they should be "rewarded" like other CEO, To be honest its a good thing for some of these churches to close. Like the man said on an earlier post you will have to look for yourselves to find a good fundamentalist church where the preaching is strong, but the pastor is loving and humble. It can only get worse for most churches, as the pastors have bought into this lie of the Devil. They see other ego centered mega church pastors and they think they are just as good or better speakers and they go for the GOLD rather than GOD and HIS written WORD. God help us get over this mess of pottage.
ReplyDeleteVines really hit on it. Whether Mac and those present applied the "obvious" word to themselves, who knows. Maybe this is why MA went to Chart House. Maybe he knew what was coming.
ReplyDeleteThis clip is not from this year, but from THREE YEARS AGO. He preached this as Mac was sitting there, waiting in the wings for Vines to leave. Just a few weeks later we were introduced to "Team Brunson" and we all cried and voted "Aye" to call Mac and Debbie and Trey Brunson as our pastors.
ReplyDeleteVisit Maurilio's blog and you'll see an article he wrote about Linda and Harold McNeil.
Vines was 100% correct in this description of FBCJ today. And indeed what is happening in general to churches. But we must keep in mind that we are in the "Falling Away" of the church and in the last days of Bible prophecy! So we may expect what we are seeing. I would really hate to be one of the preachers of a church that is "falling away".
ReplyDeleteSorry didn't notice date, but clip and content were certainly "timely".
ReplyDeleteVines preached this sermon in 2006, and STILL recommended Mac for this church? Sometimes departing preachers don't like successful preachers to follow them. Maybe this was such a case. Too many clues here. With Mac FBCJ was guaranteed to fail. Whatever, Vines's sermon was prophetic and accurate. Just my opinion.
ReplyDeleteGlad someone put the humanity back into thes "saintly" beings called preachers. In some cases, the former preachers want the incoming preachers to be a "problem" for the church, so the members will say, "Oh, if we just had so and so back". Referring to the former preacher. Warped, I know but, sometimes egos are so entrenched that it just happens. Not saying this is the case, but,I have seen it happen.
ReplyDeleteMaybe the reason the glory of the Lord departs from churches (on the whole) has to do more with what's going on (or not going on) in the pew, than what's going on (or not going on) in the pulpit! Just so you know, I've sat in the pew and preached in the pulpit, so I know both sides of the issue. It's easy to critize what you don't know or what you think you know!!!! Just a thought!!! Take it or leave it but in the end, God does the judging, we aren't that smart!
ReplyDeleteanon 1:13 - you are right, it could be what is going on in the pew. But when a new pastor comes in and immediately starts with the actions and behaviours documented on this blog, we can be reasonable certain it is the pastor in this case. Not those in the pew that continue to give and serve faithfully as they have done for over 60 years!!!!!
ReplyDeleteAnon 1:13
ReplyDeleteIf you have not sat in the pews at FBCJ, you have no clue as to what has happened to the church. The pew sitters were "happy" and, yes gullible not knowing there were vultures such as Brunson coming into town to "take control" of their personalized kingdom.
Thank you anon. 3:l4 pm: Those of us who have been in the pew at FBCJ for years and years have a hard time, when being told by ignorant "late-comers" what the problems are. Watchdog has laid out the problems clearly on this blog. But just for the record; after Lindsay died, I was told from a good authority, that 2,000 people left under the Vines tenure. Vines was another one that did not take instruction well, especially if he didn't like you.
ReplyDeleteVines and Johnny Hunt are good friends. Just look where Vines now attends church in Georgia, which is his home base.
ReplyDeleteHomer Lindsay kept things under control. His death opened the door for what is now in place; Vines set the stage. Yes he is an absolutely marvelous, expository preacher, but he know from whence the dollar cometh.
I believe today marks the 9th anniversary of Dr. Lindsay's passing. Little did we know then, that it was such a huge turning point for the church. If we knew what was in front of us, I wonder if we would not have chosen to just close the doors, rather than turn the (then) solid soul winning church into the mess it is today. My astonishment is how easily this has come about.
ReplyDeleteI will always be thankful to the Lord for allowing me the gift and the priviledge of being under the preaching of Dr. Lindsay. He taught me (simply) how to study my bible, how to witness, and how important these things were. He taught me that my life was not just mine. It belonged to the Lord, and what I did with it mattered. He also taught me how to treat others. I must confess I am still having trouble with how others treat me, including some preachers. But, God knows all, and I am responsible for me. After all, not all, including most preachers, had the gift of a Dr. Lindsay in their life. An additional blessing was his "perfect" partner in life and ministry "Ms. Shirley". Both of them really lived for Jesus. For them, many are grateful. How we miss them!