Update: TU Reporter Tia Mitchell has an article following up Brumley's asking her readers questions about FBC Jax's plan to have members go with Brunson for his invocation - she quotes the WD - check her out, and chime in on her comments section!-------
Read Jeff Brumley's article in the Times Union today on the latest news of the Jacksonville City Council prayer policy:
A couple of miscellaneous comments from the Watchdog in response:
- I'm glad that Brumley has gotten the word out that Brunson has invited his church members to hear his prayer. I wonder if Jacksonville citizens will see this as I do: FBC Jax again flexing their political muscle to make a statement ABOUT prayer, rather than just being grateful for the privilege and coming to humbly pray.
- Let's see, if FBC Jax can get hundreds to file in for the prayer and then quietly leave after the "Amen", maybe the Jews and the Muslims and then the Lutherans and the Catholics can do the same - maybe even outdo the FBCJ'ers.....and then maybe Jack Webb can set the prayer rotation by the number of people who turn out! Maybe we can have an "Amen meter" measure the intensity of the concluding Amen. If FBC Jax has hundreds show up next Tuesday, they get first dibs on the next prayer date in the rotation. If the Catholics only get a few: back of the pack you slackers, you don't take your faith serious enough!
- Or better yet: if they really want to pray that badly down at City Hall, maybe we can get the religious folks to PAY for the privilege! This could actually be a city revenue enhancer! Churches pay zero taxes on their revenue, so this could be their way to finally contribute to the city coffers. In fact, City Hall can follow FBC Jax's lead and start CHARGING for the privilege of getting time on the City Hall stage! FBC Jax charges ministries for "promotions packages" during their pastor's conference to sell exposure on their auditorium screens and on bottled water and conference bags and every other way imaginable, so maybe the city can hire a promotions firm and it won't be long until we hear:
"Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to our August 2010 council meeting tonight....let's give it up for MAC Baaa-RUNSONNNN...tonight's prayer and bottled water is brought to you by the good people of FBC Jacksonville...where Jesus is number one, and we take church discipline to a ho-nutha level!! Now, the man you've been waiting for, the pray-er of the day-er: heeeeeeeere's MAAAAC!"
We can call it "Prayer for Pay" or "Let the Pray-er be the Payer".
Ok, back to some serious thoughts:
- FBC Jax seems to make the wrong moves over and over on this matter. Redman demands the Muslim professor to pray like a trick pony. Smyrl declares the Catholic church a cult, and that Muslims must be converted or our kids will come under Muslim law. Yarborough tells reporter Mark Woods he is not sure Muslims have a right to hold political office. Brunson gets the privilege to be the first to offer a prayer under Webb's tenure, he tells his followers to show up en masse for the prayer. What's next?
- I wonder why Brunson declined to be interviewed by Brumley. He has complained in the past about not getting positive press coverage from the paper, and here Brumley wants to get the word out about his prayer. Is Brunson not speaking to Brumley anymore?
- The story says Jack Webb is Catholic. Yikes, that spells trouble for him with the FBC Jax folks on the council. Jim Smyrl, FBC Jax's 2nd in command preacher behind Brunson, has written and preached that the Catholic church is a "cult", and has called a priest a "cult leader". Smyrl has even gone as far as telling his followers at FBC Jax that they should befriend Catholics so they can confront them with "living a lie" as a Catholic. Will Smyrl be there to confront Webb about living a lie? Is Yarborough and Redman concerned that they elected a cult member as the council president?
- Yarborough is concerned that this move toward opening the prayer to other faiths spells trouble, possibly leading the city to "decay". I think having too much Baptist influence in this city - FBC Jax in particular - has already spelled trouble and embarrassment for our city, so maybe we should be looking for inclusion of some others.
Actually, I'm not all that concerned about whether there is prayer at the City Council. I don't think God is impressed at all, and He probably rolls his eyes when he sees these professional religious leaders piously praying in public. Most of them will read a prayer they have written, and many will be using the prayer not so much to talk to God, but to talk to the city council through the prayer.
But I think City Hall needs to be more like the modern day evangelical mega church: to the greatest extent possible, use religious-oriented events like invocations as opportunities to raise revenue from gullible religious folk, charging dollars wherever they can be charged.
It is the modus operandi in the church nowadays, so why not City Hall?
14 comments:
Me thinks that prayer should be done in a closet, not in an open area particularly in a business setting where most attending just want to get on with the meeting and who pay little if any attetion to prayer. Most if not all couldn't tell you five words that were uttered ten minutes later. If this is to be believed to be serious then maybe I missed something!!!This is a sad commentary but true. Public prayers are sort of like "lip service" to God. If people really are serious about asking Gods blessing then God will know it, and many wrongs will be righted, as people change.
It use to be that prayer meetings were held in church on Wednesday night. The pastor would get down on his knees and members of the church would do likewise or sit quietly while God was praised and asked to intervene on behalf of the congregation for peace, health, tranquility, and Gods will. I guess those days are gone forever? I suppose that is what real change is all about!!!
AFRAID OF THE MEDIA BUT NOT THE PULPIT!
I'm a subscriber to the Florida Times Union and feel Jeff Brumley wrote an excellent article in today's paper.
I have never found fault in what Mrs. Brumley writes and personally like his work as he's certainly makes sure he covers all religions fairly.
Why Mac Brunson refused to speak to him is beyond me. The only reason I can think of is that Brunson is still holding a grudge against Jeff and the Florida Times Union.
Not speaking to the press is like treating them as an enemy which is wrong - the media's job is to ask questions to get the full picture on the leads that come into their department. Nothing wrong with that!
AFRAID OF THE MEDIA BUT NOT THE PULPIT!
I'm a subscriber to the Florida Times Union and feel Jeff Brumley wrote an excellent article in today's paper.
I have never found fault in what Mrs. Brumley writes and personally like his work as he's certainly makes sure he covers all religions fairly.
Why Mac Brunson refused to speak to him is beyond me. The only reason I can think of is that Brunson is still holding a grudge against Jeff and the Florida Times Union.
Not speaking to the press is like treating them as an enemy which is wrong - the media's job is to ask questions to get the full picture on the leads that come into their department. Nothing wrong with that!
I have a two part comment related to this matter.
First, I distinctly remember when Pastor Mac Brunson requested from men of FBC Jax to be part of a "Charles Spurgeon furnace" prayer group of 100 or 120 men to pray during the church service hours. Later this was supposed to expand to women too.
Did this happen? Is this currently happening at FBC Jax? If not, why not?
Why do I distinctly remember this? Mainly because of the tongue lashing or berating from Mac on one Sunday morning.
Second matter is related to the Church Discipline Committee. My understanding of Church Discipline is that to make certain of a believer's understanding of The Gospel. My contention is by the behavior of FBC Jax Church Discipline Committee against FBC Jax Watchdog and the actions pursued by the Church Discipline Committee by issuing trespass warnings ... The FBC Jax Church Discipline Committee does not know The Gospel. If they did, they would have treated and behaved towards Watchdog way differently, as in a Christian way.
At some point, the Church Discipline Committee has to be taught The Gospel. Can a Church Discipline Committee do a Church Discipline on themselves?
Can a Church Discipline Committee do a Church Discipline on themselves?
July 23, 2010 8:53 AM
This is the big question of the day now that church discipline is so popular.
Who disciplines the discipliners?
Regarding Mac Brunson not talking to Jeff Brumley, presumably because Brumley accurately reported that Mac called Mr. Rich "mentally unstable" and a "sociopath." Once again, FBC and Millionaire Mac's respond exactly opposite of how they should. Mac decides not to speak with Brumley or give him anymore quotes on matters, which makes Brumley rely even more on "a blog that follows FBC Jax." Is Mac forcing the media to look to secondary sources now? Not what mac wants to be doing.
Second, shouldn't Mac be doing the opposite with Brumley? Inviting him in for stories, quotes and developing a good, trusting relationship with him. Use that charisma and charm on him Mac and Debbie, don't ignore him.
But it is that Brunson way. Say or write something we don't like and we will make sure you see what a mistake that was. Just like we did it in 8th grade.
So far both Tom and Brumley have written things the Brunson's didn't like and both are shunned and disliked now? Grow up, Brunsons. Where are the Godly Christian counselors to help these people deal with others lovingly and with kindness.
FBC Jax, continues to get it wrong on every issue. Prayer at the council and Brumley. Caner and the WD, Gilyard, Messer, and on and on.
Its what makes this blog so interesting. Still.
Arrogance. Since when will a humble, servant of Jesus pastor not want to talk to the religion writer of the local newspaper?
Or maybe, like was done with Don Redman at the city council meeting when he asked the Muslim to pray to his God, LAWYERS have stepped in and told these rednecks to muffle their moronic statements so that they don't get into the press?
If I was a lawyer for FBC Jax I would have clear instructions to Mac, Smyrl and the rest of that bunch: No more quotes that will make front page news articles...you hillbilly, redneck morons! Two lawsuits you caused for the church and the city right now are enough!
Thanks to Jeff Brumley for being more open, honest and transparent than good ole Mac.
Typical.
Sad, but true.
satan must be smiling at what is happening. We are pitting one group against another. I bought into the fundamentalist line at one time. Then it seemed to me they left no room for an opinion except the party line.Now we can't even have a simple heart-felt prayer at a public meeting without lines being drawn in the sand. When satan laughs God cries.
anon 12:59. And whose fault is it that this ocurred?
FBCJ has a Communications Director and a Marketing Group. Why doesn't Jeff interview them since they both know what Mac thinks and are paid employees whose job description calls for them to speak about it.
Anon 12:59. The last time GOD cried was for Lazarus. "Jesus wept". I do not think you can compare God to a mere mortal on this silly mess. Its not that big of a deal....
As a former long-time member of FBC Jax I have never been more proud to say I am a FORMER member.
I once was blind but now I see.
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