"...When He [Jesus] saw the crowds, he had compassion for them, because they were harassed and helpless, like sheep without a shepherd." Matt 9:36

"Do not rob the poor, because he is poor... for the Lord will take up their case and plunder those who plunder them." Proverbs 22:22-23

Thursday, December 27, 2007

Gilyard's Ugly Past

If you want a look at what the REAL Darrell Gilyard is all about...if you want to know what his past was, read the article located from the Dallas Morning News dated July 14, 1991:

"The Downfall of a Pastor" - Dallas Morning News

After you read this article in its entirety, you'll see how Paige Patterson, the President of the Southwest Baptist Theological Seminary, and a regular preacher at FBC Jacksonville's Pastor's Conference, played a very significant role in Gilyard's years in Texas. One must wonder after reading this why Patterson did not do more to stop this man from pastoring churches when it was abundantly clear he was a serial womanizer and couldn't control his zipper. One also has to wonder: how many women will come forth from Shiloh? Hopefully they will be encouraged to come forth by the leaders of Shiloh and will not be questioned or intimidated like the women were who made allegations about Gilyard in Texas.

After reading this, my respect for Paige Patterson continues to diminish. Earlier this year he asked his student body to pray for poor 'ole Mac Brunson who never got a "honeymoon" from his congregation (which is just not true as I chronicled here.)

31 comments:

Anonymous said...

I can assure you that EVERY major Baptist leader and/or pastor in the SBC knew very well about Gilyard and what he had been doing. Because most of them were embarrassed at having anointed him as "the next Billy Graham" they simply chose to hide and do nothing.

They should all hang their heads in shame and apologize to all the women Gilyard has abused.

concernedSBCer said...

My daddy used to say "where there is smoke, there's bound to be a fire." I find it impossible to believe that that many women were ignored. I agree with you, watchdog, I have no respect left for Paige Patterson. There is no way ALL those women were "lying."

This cover-up is a hard pill to swallow because church is supposed to be a "safe" place....at least from within. Leadership should be ashamed of covering it up for so long...just another black eye for the Baptists.

When is someone going to say "Enough" and step up to the plate to demand a correction in course?

Anonymous said...

The Dallas Morning News account sounds 100% accurate. Anyone who knows Paige knows that it sounds just like him. It fits him to a T and the sad thing is that he is now President of one of our leading seminaries.

New BBC Open Forum said...

From the previous thread...

anonymous wrote:

"I don't know Steve Gaines in person but I do read the anti-BBC blog and I can be pretty sure that none of them would approach him in a respectful manner. Read their posts--it tells you a lot about their attitudes.

"I just read the article that anti-BBC quoted and its pretty accurate."


I don't know if I'm speaking to/of the same "anonymous" poster(s) from the previous thread or not. It would be helpful if people who post to blogs would register with a unique screen name so you could tell one writer from another! It's simple to do, and you can still preserve your anonymity.

Anyway, in response to the anonymous 10:01 a.m. and 10:10 a.m. comments from the previous thread, respectively (and respectfully), the NBBCOF is not an "anti-Bellevue" blog, and the people who post there are not "anti-Bellevue." We love our church and have been grieved to see one greedy, power-hungry man and his handful of rich yes-men hijack and derail a once-great church and scatter thousands of its members.

The article quoted was not a defense of or criticism of Joel Gregory. My reference to it was meant only to illustrate the tactics of certain mega-church pastors as described by an earlier anonymous poster. You are most correct that Gregory brought many of his own problems on himself.

As for being able to speak with Steve Gaines personally, I know several people who have tried repeatedly to meet with him only to not be able to get past Administrative Pastor, David Coombs, a behemoth of a man no doubt chosen to further intimidate people. There was a group of 12 concerned men, not a lynch mob, who tried unsuccessfully to meet with him. David Coombs told another member who respectfully asked for a meeting with Gaines, "I cannot recommend that he meet with you. I can't see how any good would come of it."

I suppose he wasn't fast enough on his feet to escape in time, and some members were speaking with Gaines following the "monkey business" meeting held in March, and one man asked, in a respectful tone, why he wasn't ever accessible to the membership. Gaines, who was already testy and defensive from a couple of earlier questions, got even more defensive and said, "Look, there are over 30,000 members in this church. I can't be accessible to all those people! I never knew a lot of the people at Gardendale in all the years we were there. I just can't be that accessible to people!" It's interesting to note that the venerable R.G. Lee reportedly knew the name of every member of Bellevue when he was the pastor, and there were some 9,000 members even then.

And for the record, Bellevue has never been a 30,000-member church even though that's what the media and other sources regularly report. By the administration's own admission, almost a year ago when there were nearly 30,000 names on the roll, they couldn't find 12,000 of the people behind those names because they never purge the rolls. That left about 18,000 members of record, and it's declined by a few thousand since then... so do the math.

Please try to get your facts straight before throwing out unwarranted and untrue accusations and speculations about the members of Bellevue. It's not my intention to interject Bellevue's business into Jacksonville's situation or to hijack "watchdog's" blog, but I will correct the record when necessary.

I'd like you to know that there are plenty of us in Memphis who are praying for you and your church. It seems you are now where we were about a year ago. I don't want to be pessimistic or discourage you from trying to hold Mac Brunson accountable, but I believe, short of an act of God, you're fighting a losing battle. As they say, power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Brunson and Gaines have tasted power, and they're not going to change or go away quietly. The SBC machine is alive and well, and they are not going to give an inch. They're going to hold on for as long as the money, power, and prestige hold out. I encourage you to just keep shining the light of truth into the darkness.

Anonymous said...

Sheri said...

It will be interesting to see what Drs. Paige Patterson and Jerry Vines choose to say about this issue at the FBC Jax Pastor's Conference in February. In light of what we've been reading from the news articles on this site, they can do nothing less than publicly denounce this kind of Pastoral abuse. The Pastors in attendance at the FBC Jax conference should hold their feet to the fire !!

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Sherri - they will say absolutely NOTHING about Gilyard, or his past in Texas, or Patterson's failure to alert churches of Gilyard's tendencies to seduce women in his churches. To mention it would draw attention to Patterson's failures, and Vines' extremely poor judgement in preaching at Gilyard's church in 2006.

I have to admit I was quite surprised when Vines chose to put Gilyard's church on his speaking schedule just a few months after Vines' retirement in February 2006. At that point I knew a little of Gilyard's past (that he had sex with women he was counseling) but I had no idea the extent of Gilyard's problem....but most assuredly Vines DID know that Gilyard had been accused at every church he served at in Texas (including a rape accusation) since Vines was the one who approached Patterson for Gilyard's scholarship at Criswell College; I find it hard to believe Patterson didn't keep Vines abreast of the allegations described in the Dallas Morning News article.

Vines said he did forgive Gilyard when Gilyard asked for his forgiveness a few years ago...forgiveness? Perhaps Gilyard was asking forgiveness for embarrassing Vines, and maybe lying to Vines...but forgiveness for the sins themselves is up to God and those offended. So its quite a shock that Vines would preach at Gilyard's church. If my sister or daughter had been one of Gilyard's victims, I would be incredibly hurt that Vines would go preach at Gilyard's church. I'm not trying to crucify Vines here, but when a man with Vines' impeccable character and reputation preaches at a church pastored by a serial adulterer, its a HUGE deal...it sends a signal to the congregants of Shiloh and others that perhaps all is well. Instead of Vines preaching there (would love to hear that sermon and the words he spoke on Gilyard's behalf!) what he needed to do was perhaps what Pastor George Harvey, Jr. tried to do: WARN THE CONGREGATION. Vines may have been one of the few men that really knew in detail what Gilyard had been accused of in the past. Instead of warning the church he went there and preached.

So no, Vines, Patterson, and Brunson will say nothing of the Gilyard mess...but they will most assuredly speak of the evils of anonymous emails and how bloggers are divisive. Think how sick it is that Vines went and preached at Gilyard's church in 2006 putting his stamp of approval on Gilyard's ministry there, then in Feb 2007 on his first visit back to his old church at the pastor's conference Vines scolded his congregation for anonymnous emails and attacking those who dare question the Brunson's salary and perks and the $300,000 land gift. He sure had it backwards...praise the serial adulter, scold the congregation for trying to hold Brunson accountable...

New BBC Open Forum said...

watchdog wrote:

"Sherri - they will say absolutely NOTHING about Gilyard, or his past in Texas, or Patterson's failure to alert churches of Gilyard's tendencies to seduce women in his churches. To mention it would draw attention to Patterson's failures, and Vines' extremely poor judgement in preaching at Gilyard's church in 2006."

Precisely! They will not mention it publicly for the very reasons "watchdog" stated. But wouldn't you love to be a fly on the wall at some of their little lunch and dinner get-togethers?

Anonymous said...

Sheri said...

Watchdog - Unfortunately, I think you might be right. But I still thank God for you and for this blog, because it is such a POWERFUL source of information!

I still hold out some hope that even though these arrogant "Rock Star" pastors deem themselves too powerful to have to answer to their congregations, they might feel some accountability to their peers. That's why it's so important for the other SBC pastors to be informed, and demand answers from Patterson, Vines, and Brunson. And the FBC Pastor's Conference will provide a perfect opportunity to hold them accountable IN PERSON.

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Sheri - that is an excellent point. Instead of these pastors coming to Jacksonville to be awestruck by these pastors and line up to get their autographs, they really should ask some tough questions to the likes of Brunson and Patterson and Vines...or maybe send a message by NOT coming when they have come in years past. Afterall, the registration fees are going into the pockets of the already fat wallets of these mega church pastors.

Afterall, why come to Jax if you're a humble SBC pastor serving in a small church? In years gone by perhaps they wanted to come and see some of the innovative things we were doing at Jax...now all the staff is gone, we're doing nothing innovative (OK, a school maybe, we have some classes from seminaries offered at the church, door to door evangelism has been declared dead by Brunson). Besides, the really major services are live fed over the Internet!! So pastors save your churches money and send a message to these fat cats, and still enjoy the sermons if you wish over the Internet.

justmyopinion said...

That is why this type of blog is GOOD. It allows facts to come out that would not ordinarily come out. I say "stay the course Watchdog".justmyopinion

concernedSBCer said...

The thing that puzzles me is that other pastors don't seem to be holding each other accountable. The Gilyards, Gaines, Pattersons and Brunsons of the world seem to still be held in high regard even though (in Gilyard and Gaines' case) laws have been broken. It seems to me that other pastors are the perfect people to hold these accountable because 1) they understand the call, 2) they understand the pressure, and 3) what these mega pastors do effect (and reflect on) our entire denomination!

Anonymous said...

I knew about Gilyard in the early 1990's and i lived in NC then. I heard it all the way up there in the small town of Hooterville, so I can't imagine that people here didn't know what was up with that guy. I heard him preach once, and thought he was great...the stuff came out two weeks later. I knew stuff about some of the independent churches around HERE in the 1970's when I lived here. Stuff that hasn't made the news but should have. I knew junk about some pastors in NC when I lived there. I've been in more than one church where junk happened. I mean real true honest horrible stuff. Which is why i get so TICKED OFF WITH THIS BLOG AND YOUR COMPARISON OF BRUNSON TO THESE PEOPLE. You are nuts to do that. Go get in one of these churches sometime, have some memories you will never erase, irrevocable harm done to YOU, and then come back here and tell us what an idiot you were to attack a person who is serving God. GILYARD HAS AN UGLY PAST, NOT MAC BRUNSON, PAIGE PATTERSON, ETC. Why don't you count your blessing snoop doggy dog and others?

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

You miss the point anon.

No comparison between the offenses of Brunson and Gilyard.

The point is that what allows Gilyard to operate as he has done in abusing women, what allowed Bob Gray to operate and molest children for years, is the PASTOR WORSHIP that is heaped on these mere men. They are elevated to rock star status, as untouchable, and they surround themselves with people who don't hold them accountable.

Take a look at the $300,000 land gift given to Brunson....what on earth would compel a man to give a gift of $300,000 to a pastor he/she hardly knows, JUST BECAUSE they are the new pastor at FBC Jax? Wasn't there some other saint at FBC Jax who had been serving for years and years who could have used that gift or 1/10th of that gift? Sure there were, but those saints weren't FAMOUS MAC BRUNSON. But someone for some reason gave the man a $300,000 gift EVEN THOUGH our church is already paying him very handsomely, and he had the poor judgement to take it. Please don't tell me it was God, please don't tell me that, I've heard it enough from Benny Hinn and Paula White and others that the riches their followers heap on them is "from the Lord".

It is this kind of pastor worship that creates an environment where abusers of congregations can flourish.

Anonymous said...

Would YOU have turned it down? The land I mean? I'm not missing the point either. If you support the pastor does that constitute hero worship? I don't know anything YET that you have come up with about Mac Brunson that puts him on the level of a Darrell Gilyard. I don't hero worship NOBODY...on that you can rely. Its just nice to be in a church for once where the people on the staff appear to be sincere Christians and trying to serve God. I won't criticize that. Sorry. (and i hate idolatry of people...i mean HATE it.) I would also like to commend that pastor who stood up to Gilyard and the woman who posted on here who REPORTED him...thats a truly brave person. She's probably been spit on immensely by Christians. Thats just how it goes. But there's this line, this distinction between truly having a reason to complain against a pastor and complaining against innocent pastors and staff members. I don't quite know whats up on this blog. You keep running it all together in my mind.

Anonymous said...

And that is where you are wrong, "Watchdog". We haven't been abused one bit.

PK said...

On the land, what 1 private citizen gifts to another is really none of our business unless he used the Hinn model of scamming the member through the church. Church members believe that every aspect of the Pastor's life is open for public discussion and act as if they have a clue as to what really happened. You do not know what happened and just because it was you pastor doesn't automatically make it your business.

I grew up in a Pastor's home and people were always whining about his car a local dealer supplied or his suits a local men's store supplied etc.. Whether or not a church member chooses to gift something to his Pastor is their business period. For Goodness sake shut up and quit whining about that stupid piece af land, what do you want him to do, give it back? The other issues are so much more important.

Anonymous said...

I don't know if I'm speaking to/of the same "anonymous" poster(s) from the previous thread or not. It would be helpful if people who post to blogs would register with a unique screen name so you could tell one writer from another! It's simple to do, and you can still preserve your anonymity.


Hear! Hear! Watchdog, ask the moderator of New BBC Open Forum how to do this, if unsure.

Anonymous said...

Sounds like a lot of "chasing" going around here. Work slow? TAKE IT TO THE LORD IN PRAYER ... again.

paul z said...

pk, why would he do a silly thing like quit talking about it? I bring it all up, and all I hear is I have some mysterious ax to grind with his precious church I really don't care about.

To some of the others, and I guess to watchdog also whom I sure will defend the former pastor, tell me once again I have some ax to grind, claim he knows why I left FBC even though he has no clue as to those reasons, etc.

The first time I ever saw Paige Patterson preach was the 2000 Pastor's Conference, and whatever he said or did caused me to lose any respect I had for him. Maybe it was too much pomp, circumstance, and stroking of the SBC as a whole since I am not a organizational person. I don't remember exactly what it was, but something he did made me close my note pad and shut the bible because I knew neither were going to be necessary. After that, I avoided every service he preached in. I was in the choir and would not attend the weeks he did. And last year, after Brunson came and guest speakers were no longer announced, he showed up to preach that one Sunday morning and my wife and I just walked out. I have no plans to listen to him say 1 word again.

Now, about Dr. Vines. I loved him, supported him, believed in him, and would have probably walked through fire for him as my pastor. But I lost a ton of respect for him the way he just left the church. Perhaps it's because of what the day he announced he was retiring was that made me react the way I did. See, I didn't live here at the time. I lived in Orlando, and Dr. Vines announced his retirement to the congregation of FBC the same day it was announced to us at First Baptist Orlando that David Uth was coming as our co-pastor. Jim Henry, havng the foresight that he was getting up in years sent a pastor search committee out to find a new pastor a year before. This is something Dr Vines should have done. Not waited until he was LEAVING to do it. From what I could tell the couple times I visited after Vines announced, and then subsequently being forced to move back here and witnessing things shortly before he left, a lot seemed to be in unspoken chaos. Things I don't think would have had Dr. Vines had the same forward thinking a couple of years before he did. I know they asked Brunson a few years back and he refused, but if you were looking for one, then maybe you should have sent a team out to find someone then.

About Gilyard, and I intend this to be the last thing I say about it. Why would Vines look bad for preaching at his church last year? They were friends. Whatever happened was forgiven. How was he to know this was still going on? I knew about what happened in Dallas because a member of the Shiloh congregation told me it happened in the past.

I also understand standing up for what's right. You will never hear me critical of FBC or any other church standing against things and calling them wrong, like gay marriage, reprobates coming in concert, preachers who distort the word of God (the crowd being scrutinized), political issues, etc.

But you are doing comes off very judgmental in your behavior and treatment of Darrell Gilyard and holding everyone else who thought he worked through it accountable. That's where I ask if you have ever sinned. After you have asked forgiveness have you ever turned around and done it again?

I said in my last comment that if these allegations are true, he should resign as a pastor, never preach again, and be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. I never suggested the man should get a pass on anything. I am simply bringing up how critical you are of him, Vines, Patterson, and anyone else who ever had any contact with the man and tried to help him.

I understand there are victims in this, and I understand they are all scarred for life. They probably were revolted by hearing he was a pastor again. Being someone who was accused of committing an illegal act as a teenager and 17 1/2 years later I am still scarred from it. I had to sit in a detective's office at age 13 and told I did things to someone I would have never dreamed of doing! And I hope and pray these victims can find something I never have, peace and reconciliation of that past. And also forgiveness of the person who put them through it.

Shame on churches in general for not doing REAL background checks on these people. My wife's parents church had someone on their staff who had an affair, and come to find out had done so in his former church. They had a practicing homo on staff there, and had they asked ANYONE in his former church who knew him, could have told them that. Since then, they do thorough backgrounds on everyone and every church should do the same thing.

I am sure somehow in saying this I "have heard too many sermons on not being judgmental", I "need my own blog," and I "have some ax to grind with First Baptist." So I'll await to hear how wrong I am about all of these issues once more, and how right you are to question every time any pastor in Jacksonville breathes.

Anonymous said...

I second the suggestion to the anti-BBC blog that they post names. But then that would destroy the novelty of their creation.

Paul Z--I totally agree with your discernment about Paige Patterson. I have known him personally for many years and you are totally accurate in your assessment.

I was a little surprised at your cautioning others about being critical and faultfinding and then using the word "homo" to refer to a staff member in a church somewhere. Perhaps you could have found a less offensive word when you were talking about another human being.

Other than that, I agree totally with your post.

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Sorry for the delayed response...computer troubles got me, and I have to go to my back up to reply.

Aonon 11:42 am: to say we have been "abused" may be a bit strong...but Mac Brunson has abused his power since he got here, and I won't bother going over it again. Its all here in the blog

pk 11:57 am: Do you hear yourself? You actually believe what you are saying? Firstly, I'm not saying the land deal is "my business"...I'm making the case that the church at large should be extremely concerned that a donor of our church gave a $300,000 gift to the pastor TWO WEEKS after he arrived here. Now if you can't see the difference between a man giving his pastor a new suit, and a rich donor of our church GIFTING $300,000 to our very rich pastor who has been in Jax for all of two weeks for "love and affection", then you have poor discernment at many levels. I certainly can see how "gifts" for "love and affection" could be given to a pastor. I could see a wealthy member giving some fine gifts to a preacher who they have come to love and appreciate after time elapses...but a rich donor giving a quarter of a million dollar gift to the new rich pastor...that does not pass the smell test and it requires the pastor to openly explain this. Did the search committee seek out this donor to "sweeten the pot" to get Mac to come here? I don't know, but it sure looks like it. This is the kind of thing that Senator Grassley is investingating mega churhces for: donors, instead of giving money to the 501(c)3 organization ("FBC Jacksonville") they instead give it to the HEAD of the 501(c)3 organization ("Mac Brunson"). Now Senator Grassley is asking questions like: "Why are your donors giving huge gifts directly to the head of the organization, when they are ALREADY handsomely paid by the 501(c)3 to perform their duties, and how do these gifts further the mission of the 501(c) organization?" Can you AT LEAST see that there will be those people who will find out about the gift and believe that it is improper (including the press, incluidng unchurched people) and that alone would be enough for a wise pastor coming to a new city to pastor the largest church that already has an image of being a church of the rich white folks, to decline the generous offer? Now, as for what he should do...I've said it before and I'll say it again: he needs to come clean before his congregation and explain it. He doesn't need to explain it to me in his pastor's office, he needs to tell his congregation the circumstances behind the gift, how God was in it, and why we should not be concerned. He won't do that, because if 100% of the congregation knew of the land gift (I'd put the number now around 10% or less) about 1/4th or more would be absolutely disgusted and giving would go down. Sorry you think telling the truth is "whining" but I'll keep whining.

Anon 2:49: I'm aware of how to change my blog over to one that requires screen names. I've chosen the current set up as the one best for my blog that is still growing and reaching members of my church. At some point I may flip it over to require screen names, but I've made a conscious decision not to at this point.

Paul Z - Paige Patterson: I've always enjoyed his preaching, thought he came across as arrogant, but still had no reason to dislike him until this year. First it was the way he handled the Sheri Klouda firing at SWBTS (see Wade Burleson's blog), then it was the discovery that in February Paige declaired to his student body that Mac had been attacked by "recalictrants" ever since he came to FBC Jax - and asked for his student body (many of whom read this blog and knew the reasons Mac was facing heat - Paige - your students DO read the blogs!) to pray for poor 'ole millionaire Mac. Now we find out that PP did very little to stop Gilyard. About Vines and the transition: yes, it would have been great to have Vines find someone to copastor during a transition...and after Lindsay's death he tried to make that happen is what I'm told. He did approach Mac several years after Lindsay's death...but I too wish he had selected someone to work with him. I don't think its because he didn't want to, but there were other reasons. Remember though: even Bobby Welch and FBC Daytona Beach did the "co pastor transition" route and that was an utter disaster as the pastor lasted not a year I believe. So going the co-pastor route doesn't ensure smooth transitions - its the character of the man selected. About Gilyard: Yes, it was very poor judgement for Vines to preach in Gilyard's church, because even by Vine's understanding of the Bible and how he interpreted scripture: DARRELL GILYARD WAS UNFIT TO BE A PASTOR OF ANY CHURCH. Plain and simple. In fact, Gilyard couldn't even be a Deacon at FBC Jax - he is divorced. So going to preach in a man's pulpit that you would not allow come preach at your own church after he was found to be a serial adulterer, is just being, well, maybe a "hypocrite". And further, its just plain dangerous for a guy with Vines reputation and character to give Gilyard the look of respectability by having Vines preach at his church. I won't go any further than that...to give a man with a serious problem like Gilyard the look of respectability - dangerous. Did Vines know Gilyard might be sending text messages to young girls? Of course not...but Vines DID know the extend of Gilyard's sordid past.

Lastly Paul about Gilyard: you say if these allegations are true he should resign. You're wrong. The church doesn't have to wait to find out about these allegations to make a decision on his suitability to be pastor...HE SHOULD NEVER HAVE BEEN PASTOR TO BEGIN WITH...he was a serial adulterer (admitted!) and he admitted to having sex with women in his church THAT CAME TO HIM FOR COUNSELING. That disqualifies him. Period. And the people at Shiloh I hope realize that and are aware of this and will send him packing sooner rather than later. And the leaders of the church who knew of Gilyard's past that kept quiet about it - I hope they are sent packing to. If he's living in Queen's Harbor in $900,000 house, Gilyard is probably earning a salary of $300,000 or more from his church. As a weekly salary that is $6000. Save that money Shiloh and immediately put him on UNPAID administrative leave while you investigate his past. Call me judgemental or call me the truth teller...I don't care.

Lastly: too bad there wasn't a blogger in the last 5 years or so since blogging became popular, that was blogging about Gilyard and shining a light on his past mis-deeds. This might have reached a few members who would have wised up to Gilyard. Of course it is interesting to think what Gilyard's response would have been to a blogger blogging about his past: He probably would have went to his closest advisors and told them that they need to change the bylaws to create a discipline committee, but let as few members as possible know so they don't get suspicious. Then he would probably preach sermons on the terrible societal ill of being "judgemental and critical", how it is destroying marriages, children, society, etc. Also, he would want to try to mention church discipline, and how people might be brought in front of the church who are divisive...wait, that is beginning to sound eerily familiar!!!

Anonymous said...

I totally agree with your thoughts about the $300,000 gift. I would have no problem with it at all if Mac had been there for 10 or more years but the first few weeks--that's ridiculous! I would think if your deacons were on the ball they would have investigated that event.

I think it would be great if all blogs REQUIRED that people sign their real names and email addresses. Maybe it would curb some of the ungodly things that are said. I also think the blog owners should at least have had one FACE TO FACE meeting with the pastor in their church to express their concerns in person. At least that would be a good starting point.

As I have said before, I do not know of any pastor who gives any credibility to an anonymous email and/or post. If you are going to criticize and question, at least have the decency to go and meet with the pastor in person. (Of course the anti-BBC folks are going to say that they can't meet with Steve Gaines in person but I think that's just baloney.) If they won't meet, tell their secretary that you want to make a large contribution to the church and I guarantee you that you will have your meeting!

Paul Z said...

Wait..I may be about to sound like an idiot because I only scan read most things and I guess missed a vital part here. GILYARD IS DIVORCED??????

Ghost said...

Watchdog,

Unlike what I feel for Dr. Brunson, I love and respect Dr. Vines, and I hate to be critical but I absolutely agree with you about the poor judgement that he used.I heard both sermons in which Dr. Vines spoke at Shiloh this year, and last year. He was VERY complimentary of Pastor Gilyard. They made it obvious they are very close friends. Gilyard said that Dr. Vines sends him messages every Sunday morning before he preaches, and Dr. Vines said that sometimes he and Janet stay home and listen to Dr. Gilyard on the internet. Pastor Gilyard also said that Dr. Vines was his father in the ministry. Also, I'm not sure if this has been stated yet, but both of the times Dr. Vines came were for Dr. Gilyard's anniversary, so Dr. Vines is the one preacher that Gilyard wanted there to celebrate his anniversary. Again, I think the world of Dr. Vines but I think he could have used much better discernment in associating himself with Gilyard.

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Paul Z - yes, he is divorced. I didn't mention that to equate that or draw a parallel of divorce to his sins, but to simply point out that he wouldn't even qualify as a deacon at FBC Jax, let alone a preacher.

Paul Z said...

Forget FBC, if he is divorced that should disqualify him from preaching in any church.

Anonymous said...

Anon 12:20: I promise you, it isn't baloney. He's more protected than Fort Knox. I will tell you this: letters and emails have been sent, signed, directly to him. They were not answered.

SHAwasoncelostJUAN said...

Have any of you that have spent so much time putting together the FACTS about Gilyard spent any time praying for him? GOD is a merciful GOD. He forgives! Man remembers sins, compiles a list of them, and condemningly puts those who have fallen on blast for all to see. The fact that Gilyard has a past and is presently struggling in his walk with GOD, shows that he is not GOD. He is a man that was born into sin like you and I. Instead spending so much time trying to condemn this man, we should be praying that GOD does not reveal OUR transgressions. Gilyard should not be the issue. SIN is the issue. Whether it is an explicit text message or pride, a sexual encounter or a covetous heart, GOD views it all as sin. If a man that teaches the word of GOD can get entrapped into a multitude sin, then what makes any of us exempts? Go ahead and continue to cast your stones. But realize that what you consider as righteousness is nothing more that filthy rags in the sight of the Lord. Darrell Gilyard sins and so does everyone reading this blog (knowing and unknowing). Nevertheless, Darrell Gilyard has a soul and I am praying for it. If Gilyard has never come to know Christ, then we should be praying even the more: for his soul is in danger of being lost. "There is none righteous, no, not one. There is none who does good, no, not one." MAY GOD have MERCY on us all!

Anonymous said...

I'm curious as to why Duval county public record show he changed the spelling of his name??? Was that to hide from the controversy in Dallas?

Anonymous said...

Having already figured out that P.P. is full of it, his handling of this matter doesn't surprise me in the least. Had D.G. been a female you can believe P.P. would have felt it his duty to handle it "biblically". He seems arrogant and his dramatic, tear jerking stories never resonate with me and waste my time. Do a little googling and it won't take long to lose respect. Makes me question the trust I've placed in those who hang with him.

Anonymous said...

Sheri said...

SHAwasoncelostJUAN - Your point is well taken. It is a well-written reminder that we all are sinners, every single one.

The distinction is made, however, between a pastor of a church and the average Christian. Pastors' qualifications are spelled out in the book of Timothy, including the
fact that the pastor must be the husband of one wife. Pastors are held to a higher standard, and will receive a special crown in Heaven for shepherding the people of God.

Sure, we all sin, but Pastors (all of them, not just D.G.), need to be held accountable to God and their flocks for their behavior.

Finally, it is just plain foolish to purposely engage in harmful behavior and INVITE trouble.