"...When He [Jesus] saw the crowds, he had compassion for them, because they were harassed and helpless, like sheep without a shepherd." Matt 9:36

"Do not rob the poor, because he is poor... for the Lord will take up their case and plunder those who plunder them." Proverbs 22:22-23

Wednesday, March 31, 2010

Guthrie of SBC Today Defends Caner by Going on the Attack

Tim Guthrie of the SBC Today Blog has posted a defense of Ergun Caner in response to the new allegations that came to light yesterday on this blog: namely that Caner claimed in front of FBC Jax in November 2001 that he was in the "Islamic Youth Jihad" before coming to America, and that he was "trained to do that which was done on 11 September". Sorry, Tim, those aren't old allegations, those are brand new. This blog site yesterday provided hard evidence that Caner came to the states as a 4-year old and never left the country.

Guthrie's blog post really isn't a defense, but an ad-hominem attack, that is worse than any of the things said about Caner.

Guthrie doesn't deal with ONE SINGLE legitimate issue that is raised about Caner's fibs about his past, just says they are old and "nothing new".

Guthrie resorts to the old ad-hominem attacks that we are used to. Instead of addressing these documented, legitimate issues, he instead calles myself, James White, and Mohammad "minions" over and over. He lashes out at James White, attacking his degrees and his "false doctrine". He condemns Mohammad to hell dismissing anything he says because he is not a Christian.

Unbelievably, Guthrie complains about bloggers' vitriol during this holy week of Easter, yet he outdoes Caner's critics by dishing out a bigger dose of vitriol and venom himself, without addressing the underlying issues.

Guthrie says that in time Jesus will come and reveal our deeds and bring shame to us, and that our day is coming for blogging about Caner's misdeeds.

No, Tim, perhaps before Jesus comes, I think you will be embarrassed for your attacks, and for your lack of integrity in defending that which is defenseless by going on the attack. I am one who believes the trustees at Liberty University are watching the traffic on the Internet, and know that their seminary's reputation is on the line until they deal with Caner's past.

I am hopeful they will deal with it. And I hold out hope that Emir will soon chime in. As best I can tell, Emir has never engaged in the exaggerations of his brother when sharing his testimony.

Then, Tim, you can blog about THEM, and attack them for doing what YOU should have done as a peer of Caner's: hold him accountable for his exaggerations and misrepresentations that reflect poorly on YOU and your fellow SBC preachers.

Happy Easter, Tim, from the "minion" Watchdog.

53 comments:

Tim G said...

Happy Easter to you! :)

P.S.
If you will read carefully I actually did address several issues. The key is one must read!

Anonymous said...

Sorry Mr. Guthrie, your post reviewed that you yourself have joined the crowd of who you claim to be disgusting minions and garbage who expresss their opinions on this blog.

Your words in my humble opinion were just as disgusting and did nothing more but enrage bloggers to continue expressing their opinions - you returned fire with fire. One thing you did get wrong is the fact that this blog is not "Infamous" but just the opposite.

Really, you meant that when you said, Happy Easter? Don't think so!

Anonymous said...

Tim,

I read your entire BLOG...you seem to hate what you actively participate in.

The watchdog's blog at least allows a dialog from all perspectives. Yours just condemns for holding men honest.

Anonymous said...

Don't think so Tim G. The Watchdog is ABSOLUTELY CORRECT. You simply spew out vitriolic hype and present Caner as a victim. I did actually read your ENTIRE post on your blog. You never even come close to addressing Caner's fibs (actually they are flat out lies, designed to falsely elevate Caner to some Champion of the Faith). How can a "testimony" based on lies be a legitimate Christian testimony ? How can you call yourself a Christian when your entire testimony is based on lies? Thou Shalt not bear false witness. I know we all sin and fall short of the glory of God, but can you hold off for just a little while and not sin while you are giving your CHRISTIAN testimony ?

Anonymous said...

I did read and I failed to see the issues addressed.

Tim G said...

OK guys here you go:

The papers proved he was raised a Muslim. The papers proved that his birth place etc are true. Papers prove his Fathers middle name, which Ergun used in honor of him.

Any more issues?

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Tim - I want to know why in Nov 2001, just after 9/11, CAner painted a portrait of himself to FBC Jax as a person who was:

1. Raised in Europe (when the facts are he moved to Columbus, Ohio at the age of 4 and was raised there.)

2. Until the age of 15 was in the Islamic Youth Jihad (that would tough, in that he was in Columbus, Ohio)

3. Spoke broken English as a teenage after having been in the country since the age of 4 (not credible, as he lived in America since the age of 4)

and worst of all:

4. That he was "trained to that which was done on 9/11", until he came to America and got saved. (where would he have received such training? Is he saying his Muslim father was training him to do these things? The people at the mosque he attended in Columbus?)

Tim, it's not your place to defend Caner. Those are his words. Those are not just stumbles, or that he jumbled a few words as he said in his statement a few weeks ago.

The FBC Jax sermon was at the BEGINNING of his public ministry as an expert in Islam after 9/11. He was on the biggest SBC stage at the time, and it appears to me that he used FBC Jax to paint a grossly exaggerated picture of himself to further his credibility as the premier Christian expert on Islam and Islamic terrorism.

After 9/11, who was going to speak to Christians as an authority on Islam? Who would that man be? Well, we found a man who claimed to be raised Jihad in Europe, moved to America with broken English at age 15, and found Christ at age 15.

This is more disturbing to me than even the Mohammad videos. This was the one sermon that he needed to get right, to FBC Jax right after 9/11, and now we know that he misled the people of FBC Jacksonville, and even misled Jerry Vines himself. I can't imagine that Vines is too happy to hear the CD recording of Caner's fibs on that Sunday, now that we know the timeline on Caner's upbringing.

Can you address those 4 questions, Tim, giving a sufficient explanation for the exaggerations? Or better yet, as a peer of Ergun's, call him and encourage him to address the FBC Jacksonville claims publicly. He can go on SBC Today podcast and give an explanation.

Thanks, buddy. We'll be waiting.

Anonymous said...

Gee! Tim. You play with words and dance around issues like Bill Clinton. Talk about what we think are Caner's lies. Just address one. Is Caner leading us to believe he was raised as a Jihadist, speaking a Muslim language and raised in a Muslim COUNTRY. Was he a hard core Jihadist Muslim that was converted to Christianity ? I don't think so. I think he LIED.

terriergal said...

Excellent thank you. So sad for Mr Guthrie. Seems like a Cult Of Personality following Ergun Caner, allowing his ego to get far too large. Can't admit any of their hero's flaws. So tragic. All this being done by Caner and his sycophants in the name of Christ, and it is blasphemous. He's like the next Rick Warren only with a far more glamorous (and hyped up) story.

Tim G said...

Since you guys obviously have not heard nor read the previously given response from Dr. Caner I would encourage you to do so.

It is obvious that you guys cannot be satisfied. You attack and then you attack some more.

Maybe you ought to send me to the school in Memphis where some of you were trained in this attack procedure.

You learned it well!

terriergal said...

Ergun Caner telling us he was born in Istanbul

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxBSB8qaHUs

Well maybe there's an Istanbul Sweden... where they don't allow people to go to the beach.

Tim G said...

watchdog,
since you stated in your last post to me that it was not my place to defend, I shall not.

I will say that if one is raised in a strong Islam faith, one is taught just as Caner said. The documents posted prove that this was the case. Again, if you will read you will see.

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Tim, brother, you're not making sense.

You didn't listen, obviously, to Ergun's claims at FBC Jax.

I've listened to the entire 11/20/01 sermon, and he clearly led us all to believe that day that he was raised in Europe, in Islamic Jihad, to kill Americans, and that he came to America at age 15 after being trained as a terrorist in the Islamic Youth Jihad. I was there. There were 9000 other people there. And its on audio tape, not doctored, not spliced, its all there.

I'm sorry that you are so blinded that you can't see this is wrong and very, very disturbing that a man would climb into the pulpit, with Vines sitting right over his shoulder behind him, and mislead 9000+ Christians about where he was raised, stating he was trained in the "Islamic Youth Jihad", and that he was trained as a terrorist and spoke a "different language" as a teenager when he had been raised in America.

Get off of it, Tim. You know its wrong, stop defending that which is indefensible.

Anonymous said...

What is it that you call someone when they accuse you of the same thing that they are doing?

It starts with an "H"

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

And yes, I have read Caner's statement released several weeks ago.

That is the subject of my next post.

We shall compare his explanations with the words he spoke at what was probably his first and largest venue speaking, before the book deals came and the speaking gigs...I submit to you, Tim, that Ergun again was not honest in his statement a few weeks ago. His statements at FBC Jax were not stumbles or misstatements. They were misrepresentations of his entire story. No slip ups, it was a portrait he chose to paint of himself that didn't measure up to the facts.

Anonymous said...

come on guys...get off Tim's back. It's obvious he's just trying to prove that he can be the kool aide drinker that current leadership in the SBc need and want. He's just a PP wanna be...leave the poor guy alone with his deep dark desire to be consider worthy of the "Big Boys" club!!

Tim G said...

Hmmm - I guess the attacks of my supposed desires etc. that some seem to know more than me are not at all H?

The Squirrel said...

Tim Guthrie said...
"Since you guys obviously have not heard nor read the previously given response from Dr. Caner I would encourage you to do so"

You mean that statement that Caner has since removed from his website. I notice his bio page is still missing, too...

~Squirrel

Anonymous said...

Tim G - Kinda looks to me that you have no legs to stand on.

And you seem to be a real jerk, too.

Heck even Mac hasn't ever come here to try and "vendicate" himself.

Joe Blackmon said...

So, muslims aren't going to hell, WatchDawg? You seriously think that there is any way to God other than through Jesus? Wow.

Tim G said...

Anon,
Once again I am blown away by everyone who knows more of me than I do myself. The attacks are incredible from someone Annon! at least I should get a few points for being visible. Well, maybe not since the arguments work much differently over here.

Anonymous said...

I just read Tim Guthrie's brown nosing post where he addresses Ergun personally on several occasions. Really Tim? If you want to say something to Ergun, call him or email him. Otherwise, your post, and your references to Vines, Falwell and Rogers, appear to be nothing more than a suck up wannabe trying to brown nose Caner.

Caner is not in the same league as those men, and no one but you would dare even claim it. None of those men stood and lied about their background. None had blogs about them, ever, despite decades of national leadership. All were gracious preachers and pastors. What, pray tell, do any of them have in common with Mike Caner from Ohio? Why do you try to drag in these respected men, to this issue?

And your blog pronouncing Christian blogging as dead is so dramatic. You claim to be more concerned with reaching the lost. Well, Tim, if people like Brunson and Gaines and Caner were doing that, we wouldn't need blogs like this one. Check it out. Millions of the Lord's money being spent on nepotism, buildings, renovations, salaries, cruises, marketing, etc. While ministries are being cut. Wake up Tim!

And infamous? Why that word? How is this blog infamous? Because it allows comments while yours doesn't? Because it dares to ask for accountability from leaders of the SBC?

And should I begin to attack your credibility because I don't agree with your brown nosing B.S.? That is what you immediately did with White and Mohammed. Attack the messenger because I just can't deal with the issues raised.

Thanks for stopping by Tim. You are pathetic. And like you, I am trying oh, so hard, not to become vitriolic like your post was.

Will you be cruising the Danube with Mac this summer?

Tim G said...

Annon,
Should I reserve a room for you on the cruise?

By the way, you love calling me a wanna be??? Please tell me what I want to be? I sat under the teaching of those men for years. I got what I needed and what God had for me.

Love the way you guys attack and presume intentions without knowing me at all. If only I could speak with you daily to discern what it is that I wanting to accomplish each day - man would life be so much easier!

Annon, thank you for the great laugh!

Jim said...

Did Guthrie bother to express any concern for Caner's quesionable educational credentials...especially his Doctorate gained via online/correspondence "education." Of course, one doesn't have to be well educated to be a good "snake-oil" salesman. He just has to have a good story...true or not.

Anonymous said...

Tim G - exactly. I don't know and can't honestly claim to know your heart or what it is you "want." I was being obviously ridiculous in response to all the points you raised in your post about blogging, about this "infamous" blog, about Mr. White and Mohammed, about blogs being vitriolic. Go back and read your post and you can see many conclusions being drawn by you about us. Couldn't it be that some genuine Christian brothers have some legitimate concerns about what they are seeing from the likes of Caner, Brunson, Gaines, and the like. (No need to compare Rogers and Falwell to these guys!)

You think leadership is under "attack", imagine if you were to publicly question any of these leaders this blog has questioned. Then sir, you would know what being attacked really means.

I am glad you had a laugh. That was partially my intent. But why not come on here lovingly, and humbly, and help us see that what Mr. Caner said to us was true. That the issues raised are not legitimate and why they aren't. Why not show us love and kindness. Why not join us in calling for more openness and transparency and leadership?

Why attack the WD and his "infamous" blog? As long as leaders continue to refuse to be open and accountable, and as long as they view questions as "attacks", then blogs like this are useful and as you stated, will be around forever.

Anonymous said...

Blackmon wrote: So, muslims aren't going to hell, WatchDawg? You seriously think that there is any way to God other than through Jesus? Wow.
___________________________________
WOW is right! Where did WD say that? He didn't. But nice try using the slippery slope argument. Just because a Muslim may be going straight to hell doesn't mean he isn't telling the truth about Islamic lies being told by Caner. And just because Caner may trust in Christ for his salvation, does not mean he is not standing in the pulpit and telling a bold face lie. Right?

By the way, are Bill Bennett, Sean Hannity, Bill O'Reilly, Urban Meyer, Billy Donovan, et al all going to hell too? WOW. Is Mother Teresa in hell too? Please enlighten us Joe. Jim Smyrl says we need to let them know they are living a lie. Do you agree?

I just can't believe Tim Tebow would let his beloved coach, Urban Meyer, and the entire family, Shelly Meyer and the girls, all burn in an eternal devil's hell. I mean us Baptists know the only way to heaven and that is via Jesus AND tithing and serving in the church and being obedient to God's man and not blogging, and... never mind.

Anonymous said...

Tim - you want significance. You want to be respected. "Sitting under" these men you respected does not give that to you. Jesus is enough. Serve Him by ministering to those in need. (the orphan, widow, poor, hungry, naked, jailed) Don't run a blog, don't run to the defense of liars, don't look for the approval of men. Go minister. Go away. :)

Anonymous said...

You guys are getting a taste of how the 'machine' works.You mean you did not read Guthries post and see ALL the quesitons are answered and all vindicates Caner and that makes you all just attacking the "anointed" ones SO you are the real sinners!

Welcome to the CR.

The only problem is that blogs can check information and verify information. That can put a leaders own words in real time on the internet and check them against other words said elsewhere.

My guess is the CR would never have happened with the internet. Patterson would have been fired way back at the imfamous airport meeting with the big dogs of the SBC. They would have been too embarassed to do otherwise because Patterson's rap sheet would have been pubished on a blog by then.

You all have to understand that Tim learned from the best spinners around. It has worked in the past to rebuke you and claim that you cannot see the truth (and besides, as they would say, you don't know all the facts) Well, those days are over. A big light is shining in the dark back rooms. Now they just look like they are circling the wagons to protect their SBC political party. And that is basically all it is.

Those are some nasty guys over at SBC Today. Real nasty and arrogant. I would suggest getting a list of their churches and warning folks in those cities what they are really like.

The "coward" anon...because I KNOW first hand what they do to folks.

Anonymous said...

(No need to compare Rogers and Falwell to these guys!)


Oh, how little you know....

Anonymous said...

Tim G,

Dang you are obnoxious. Good grief! We know plenty about you but the words coming out of your mouth. That is usually all it takes. Man you are just a real piece of work.

Keep coming on here blasting and keep driving my point home.

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Love ya brother Joe.

Mohammad, I know you are likely reading this stuff here, and I apologize in advance.

Yes, Joe, Mohammad is heading for hell without Christ. He needs to repent and accept the forgiveness of his sins by the blood of Jesus Christ. If he doesn't do that, he will be going to hell. I hope he does that. But sadly, the way he was treated over at Kaufman's blog a few weeks ago by your buddies makes it all the less likely he would want to convert to Christianity. In fact, I would tell Mohammad that if Christianity made you a Joe Blackmon, well, uh....I'll bite my tongue.

Is that better? Is that the test of whether I'm one of you, Joe?

My point was that I don't need to declare people going to hell, and I certainly don't disregard someone's words because they aren't Christian. My doctor is not a Christian, but is very capable and I trust him. My dad is not a Christian, but I love him very much and he is a very smart, wise person. Is that ok, or must I wax eloquent on where my lost families members are going, else you will assume that I think there is a 2nd way to heaven and then you can call me a liberal.

The fact is, Mohammad has Caner nailed. His videos show that Caner has multiple times misled people about his past, and perhaps his qualifications to be an expert on Islam. Mohammad doesn't believe Caner is a genuine expert on Islam and he has gone to great lengths to document it.

My point is that the Jax sermon is the worst of all of them. That was before he wrote a book, and stood to make a niche for himself in Christendom by fabricating parts of his past.

And he did it with Jerry Vines, his mentor, just a few feet away.

Now THAT is bold.

Thy Peace said...

Here are ALL the posts from Ministry of Reconciliation [Debbie Kaufman]:

The Truth, The Whole Truth, And Nothing But The Truth. Is Ergun Caner Being Truthful?.

Hey Over Here! Remember Me? The Truth ,The Whole Truth, And Ergun Caner pt. 2.

Interview With Mohammad Khan: Creator Of Ergun Caner Fake Ex-Muslim Videos.

Why I Did This.

A Break Down Of The Interview With Mohammad Khan Creator Of The Ergun Caner Fake Ex-Muslim Videos.

Let’s Take A Second Look At The Interview With Mohammad Khan/Creator of Ergun Caner Fake Ex-Muslim Videos".

The Truth, The Whole Truth And Nothing But The Truth, Finally. Ergun’s Secret Biography.

One Salient Oversight said...

Judge: I direct Tim G to answer the question, namely to address the specific accusations levelled against Caner in this blog post, and to do this without questioning the motives behind the accusation.

Thy Peace said...

Alpha & Omega Ministries Apologetics Blog > Amazing Things You Read on the Internet: Issue Bazillion and One.

On a less theological, but just as tradition-bound note, I was directed to this kind, even-handed, truly brotherly blast from, from what I discern, is the Senior Pastor (!) of Arlington Baptist Church in Knoxville, Tennessee, Tim Guthrie. You hardly even know where to begin when reading something like this--the number of factual errors, emotionally-driven logical crashes, and ad-hominems, is quite impressive for a relatively short article! It takes some work to cram all of that in there!

Anonymous said...

Guthrie wrote this:

"There is absolutely nothing new being brought to light concerning Dr. Ergun Caner."

Incredible. The links proving Caner is a liar are certainly new and prove he most certainly lied even worse than we thought.

In any event, that sentence really bothered me because I know I have heard it before over and over when there was a national scandal years ago. Then it dawned on me. James Carville used to say this about the information that just kept on coming out about Clinton.

Anonymous said...

Guthrie wrote this:

"There is absolutely nothing new being brought to light concerning Dr. Ergun Caner."

Incredible. The links proving Caner is a liar are certainly new and prove he most certainly lied even worse than we thought.

In any event, that sentence really bothered me because I know I have heard it before over and over when there was a national scandal years ago. Then it dawned on me. James Carville used to say this about the information that just kept on coming out about Clinton.

Anonymous said...

From a former member of FBCJ-

Tim, poorly written tome in your blog validates what Gandhi said -

"I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."

Paraphrasing a verse with a twist..."bless them that persecute you.." because they may be right. Shelve your indignation and try to listen to others. There is real wisdom in that, but that comes with maturity. That does not come with a degree or a paid position.

Your are a victim of your own righteousness and goodness.

Tim G said...

To all the Annoms (or one or...),
it has been an interesting dialogue indeed. I wish you all a great Easter and pray that all will celebrate the great gift and work of our Lord in His resurrection for us.

Thy Peace said...

An excellent post by Pastor Wade Burleson ... (unfortunately we can not comment any more at his blog. But we have Watchdog blog to comment!)

Grace and Truth to You [Wade Burleson] > Jesus Pronounces Eight Woes on the Southern Baptist Convention (Matthew 23).

Then Jesus spoke to the Southern Baptist Convention saying: (2) The pastors and self-proclaimed leaders of the SBC have seated themselves in positions of authority; (3) Do not imitate their actions; for they say things that they themselves will not do. (4) They create heavy burdens and lay them on the peoples' shoulders for them to carry, but they themselves are unwilling to even lift a finger. (5) What they do in terms of acts of service they do only to be noticed by the world; for they lie on their resumes and take great pains to dress as the epitome of success.

donsands said...

"..Liberty University are watching the traffic on the Internet, and know that their seminary's reputation is on the line until they deal with Caner's past."

Why do we find, from time to time, those in the pulpits who make things up?
Is it a habit? Is it an outright lie?

Many in the Charismatic WofF culture make things up. I know that for sure.
But I think sometimes they really believe their own fabrication. Sounds strange, but I think the heart is so desprately wicked that humans are capable of incredible sins.

I pray the Ergun will come forth and admit he made things up about himself to sound cool in the pulpit. And perhaps he will have to step down from minstry, but he will find that his new life, and heart, will be full of joy unspeakable, and God's peace will also flood his soul.

It's a heavy burden to keep up an image.

If you always tell the truth, then you don't need to remember everything.

Blessed Maundy Thursday to you!

Anonymous said...

Off Topic:

The idea that some have of the "revered" mega pastors of the past can also be a "fantasy". I have my own story of a "revered" one that many hold up as an icon. I can say that it is a good thing the internet was not into blogging a few years ago. This particular one was very good at appearing to be what he wasn't. Gracious, kind and all knowing. It depended upon who you were, and if you were on his team. If you had your own idea about this or that and did not give over to "authority", you were to be "ousted" in a KIND way of course. Others were sent to "deal" with you. That experience has led me to never enter a church again. Most hurtful and painful. Thank the Lord I am saved and have no need for the church. I only need Jesus who has never failed me. I wonder how many preachers owe an apology to members of their past/present churches? Thanks preacher.

Anonymous said...

Please read this: From Columbia Business School, New York -

"People with Power Are Better Liars"

Dana Carney, Andy J. Yap, Brian J. Lucas, Pranjal Mehta
Working Paper, 2009


Publication type: Working paper

Research Archive Topic: Leadership, Organizations

Abstract
Telling a lie is costly: emotionally, cognitively, and physiologically. Lie-tellers experience negative emotions, cognitive impairment, physiological stress, and reveal this through nonverbal cues. The emotional, cognitive, and physiological resources taxed by lying are enhanced by the experience of social power. Power-holders enjoy positive emotions, increases in cognitive function, and physiological resilience. This research tested and found that holding power buffers individuals from the stressful event of telling a lie and leads to easy and effective deception. In situations of high (vs. low) power, lie-tellers appear like truth-tellers emotionally, cognitively, physiologically, and nonverbally.

Download PDF

Anonymous said...

This guy has left pastor's and college and seminary leaders to just dangle in the wind. This guys book "Unveiling Islam" was the source for what Dr. Vines used to make his now infamous statement that "Mohammed was a demon-posessed pedophile" at the annual meeting of the SBC in St. Louis.

Was this "fact" a lie? Did Caner just decide to keep one of the ones who was so influential in his rise neck on the chopping block? If so, this guy has no credibility, whatsoever and he needs to be exposed and dealt with!

Former FBC Insider said...

Some Guthrie-isms that stand out:

"Trying to rid myself of the thoughts of the flesh is no easy task. I know what it is like to live in a glass house. I understand the deep concerns for family safety and the tiring task of being beat upon daily while not being able to swing back in self defense at all. I feel the pain that my brother feels and yet I know that even I in my empathy can do very little to assist."

(Is it just me, or is this the most self righteous, self indulgent, sanctimonious statement you're read in quite a while?)



"The Internet has allowed people to spill their garbage. I wonder what could be accomplished if we all took the time invested in Internet fluff and instead served the Lord with all our hearts, energy and creativity. Much could be accomplished in and for the Kingdom for sure."

(Exactly what he is doing, wasting his own time spilling his own brand of garbage, and to what point of service to the Lord was this? I'll say it; insincere, phony. Oh yeah, and the 'H' word.)



"I know that the counter attacks to this post will call me hypocritical and more. That is the way it works these days. One group is free to attack while the other group is presumed guilty and must repent. How sad is the logic in that."

(He assumes the position, but which group does he belong to?)



"Christian blogging should be more than this. Our conduct as Christians should be better than this."

(But here he is claiming his right to blog like the rest of the free world. I don't consider smug conduct to be equal to Christian conduct.)



"May we all give our all to the one who died and rose for us! It is His week. Focus us Lord!"

(And his focus was what exactly???)

Anonymous said...

"Anonymous said...

This guy has left pastor's and college and seminary leaders to just dangle in the wind. This guys book "Unveiling Islam" was the source for what Dr. Vines used to make his now infamous statement that "Mohammed was a demon-posessed pedophile" at the annual meeting of the SBC in St. Louis."


Well at least Southern Baptist are in good company:

Oprah's mag gushed over memoir of fake ...

Thy Peace said...

Praisegod Barebones [The online musings of Bart Barber] > The Steely Backbone of the School of Jerry Falwell.

Considering all of this, I find it comical to observe bloggers thinking that, by turning up a little blogging heat upon Dr. Ergun Caner, they are going to be able to unseat him from his position at the helm of the Liberty Baptist Theological Seminary. I'm not going to name the bloggers and I'm not going to link to their posts, because I have no desire to be responsible for driving any traffic in that direction. But it appears to me that, just because Ergun has apologized and clarified a thing or two and because they are so ravenously going after him, they think that school of Jerry Falwell is going to cower under their attacks and boot Ergun out the door. The school that Jerry built? The people who weathered the onslaught of vicious attacks from the entire leftish establishment of media and government for more than 30 years? These people are going to bow to the pressure of bloggers in bathrobes? I'm just not seeing it. They may get a few hits every day, but these bloggers have neither the writing skills that Alfred E Newman had nor the audience that Tinky-Winky had.

Anonymous said...

2:35 blogger: Concerning writing skills....that would be spelled "leftist" instead of "leftish".

Anonymous said...

Your in Big Trouble Mister...

"volfan007 said...

Bart,

It's amazing and sad that some people want to attack...visciously attack a Brother in Christ like some people are doing. It never ceases to amaze me how mean and low down some people will go to annihilate someone that they have personal issues with. It's just plain sad.

What's even worse is that these people actually think that they're doing service to God with their obsession. It's Capt. Ahab after his white whale all over again.

I pray that God will give Dr. Ergun Caner grace and strength to withstand these mean spirited attacks. And, I pray that Liberty University will give these bloggers with an agenda the same attention that we'd all give to an anonymous letter written by some upset, mad person, who's ranting and raving like a howling dog.

David"


Woof, Woof

Anonymous said...

"Mohammed was a demon-posessed pedophile" at the annual meeting of the SBC in St. Louis."

Mohammad married a 6 year old girl and consummated the marriage when she was nine. He was a polygamist. His first wife was quite a bit older.

Anonymous said...

"The Internet has allowed people to spill their garbage. I wonder what could be accomplished if we all took the time invested in Internet fluff and instead served the Lord with all our hearts, energy and creativity. Much could be accomplished in and for the Kingdom for sure."


But isn't that the point he misses about all this? How does one "serve the Lord" as a well known PAID professional Christian who lies about himself? How is that serving the Lord? And what about those who go along with it?

No thanks. I want no part of protecting liars who claim Christ. I do not care WHO they are.

Anonymous said...

" It never ceases to amaze me how mean and low down some people will go to annihilate someone that they have personal issues with. It's just plain sad.
"

Personal Issues!?! That is rich!

This guy Caner is contradicting himself in public speaking gigs, books, internet, etc and it is a personal issue?

No, friend, it is a PUBLIC issue. Caner MADE it a public issue. Are you really a pastor, Volf? Makes me wonder what else you think is ok.

Anonymous said...

"Considering all of this, I find it comical to observe bloggers thinking that, by turning up a little blogging heat upon Dr. Ergun Caner, they are going to be able to unseat him from his position at the helm of the Liberty Baptist Theological Seminary."

Anyone who thinks Caner will be unseated because of this is blind. He will probably get a raise.

All this is doing is showing folks how bad it is at Liberty, too.

Anonymous said...

These are the same guys..Barber, Volfan and Tim G who defended Patterson to the hilt for his role in the Gilyard perversion scandals.