"...When He [Jesus] saw the crowds, he had compassion for them, because they were harassed and helpless, like sheep without a shepherd." Matt 9:36

"Do not rob the poor, because he is poor... for the Lord will take up their case and plunder those who plunder them." Proverbs 22:22-23

Thursday, August 18, 2011

Driscoll Claims to Have Specific Visions of Sexual and Violent Assaults Against Church Members: Did He Report These to the Police?



"On occasion I see things...it's the supernatural. It's a whole other realm. It's like 'The Matrix', you can take the blue pill, you can take the red pill. You go into this whole other world, and that's the way it works....I've seen women raped, I've seen children molested..."

I know I said a few weeks ago that I thought I had seen everything when I watched James Merritt pitch the Fortune HTM multi-level marketing scheme at his church.

I was wrong. I hadn't seen it all.

But NOW I think I finally have seen it all: Mars-Hill mega church pastor Mark Driscoll on tape, telling people that he "sees things" that he has special visions. Visions of rape, incest, spousal abuse, and graphic adultery - and the visions involve real people that he confronts and his visions end up being correct!

Watch the video above, and you can hear Driscoll explain the following violent crimes that he saw committed against specific individuals, that he later approached and CONFIRMED that they actually happened exactly as he saw them in the vision:

1. At the 0:25 mark of the video he describes that he had a vision of a person being molested as a 1-2 year old, confronted the victim about his vision, and the victim went and confronted the perpetrator who admitted it. The victim came back and told Mark that indeed he was right.

2. Driscoll describes in graphic detail how he had a vision of a female church member having adulterous sex with a "really tall blonde guy", graphically describing it, and even throwing in the detail that she had sex with the light on because the blonde guy was her "fantasy body type". He confronted the woman with the vision and she confessed.

3. At the 2:45 mark, Driscoll tells a person that their grandfather had molested her. She confronted her grandfather, and Driscoll says he admitted it.

4. Driscoll describes a woman at his church who walked by and he had a vision of the husband the night before throwing her against the wall, grabbing her by the throat and "physically assaulting" her. Driscoll says he confronted her with the details of the vision, and she broke down and admitted his vision was correct. Driscoll called the husband into the church and he confessed. Driscoll said he told the abuser that "Jesus told him" about the abuse, not the wife.

And elsewhere in this brief video Driscoll talks of having visions of women being raped, children molested, people abused and beaten, even children being dedicated in cultic groups as infants.

This all is too weird. The video raises the following serious questions:

- why are his visions only about perverted sex acts and physical violence? Why aren't his visions about, say, a husband who was really sweet with his wife and took her to dinner the night before, or a grandpa picking daisies with his granddaughter the day before?

- Driscoll stood in front of a camera and described specific, horrific crimes committed against specific individuals by specific offenders. Did he contact the authorities once he learned of the molestation by the grandfather? Did he call the police when he discovered that a woman actually was violently abused by her husband the night before? Was it wise to actually call the hubby and bring him in the room to confront him with the wife present? Why didn't Driscoll instead tell her to immediately go to the police station and report her husband's abusive behavior?

- if he has these accurate visions of crimes against church members that are correct most of the time, why not go to the police and offer his services? He could help them solve crimes. Perhaps he could author a TV series where the mega church preacher helps the sheriff's office solve violent sex crimes as he receives visions from Jesus of the crimes being committed, a "Justice by Jesus" show...wait, I think there is one similar to this out there. Oh, wait, I think I'm getting it now...

I guess what is most offensive about all of this poppycock is that Driscoll actually thinks people believe him.

Driscoll describes his visions as "...you can take the blue pill, you can take red pill."

I say, you can drink the grape Kool-Aid, or you can drink the cherry Kool-Aid. Take your pick, it is all the same: Looney Tunes in the world of egomaniac mega church pastors who believe they have special powers and aren't afraid to declare it in front of the camera.
---------------------------------
H/T: Coffee Trader-News and Views, Pyromaniacs Blog

154 comments:

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

I think the Mickey Mouse shirt diminishes the believability just a bit. At least he didn't have a Daffy Duck hat on, that would have destroyed all his credibility.

:)

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Rule 501.54(d) from the Handbook of Mega Church Pastors:

"When telling people in public about your special divination powers, be sure NOT to be wearing any cartoon characters on your clothing."

New BBC Open Forum said...

I think the Mickey Mouse shirt diminishes the believability just a bit.

Not really.

Thy Peace said...

Is this one of the gifts of The Holy Spirit? Is this mentioned anywhere in The Bible? Does this come under the part of visions that come true? What is so wrong with Mars Hill Church that all these things have happened to it's members? Should we say Driscoll is Gifted now?

Word Verification: guslum

I feel like I am in one now.

Douglas said...

Phil Johnson brought this to the general public’s attention a few days ago:

Pornographic Divination

The whole thing is very disturbing and Mark Driscoll needs to be held to account. He may call himself a “Reformed Charismatic” but he certainly does not speak for all Reformed/Calvinistic believers, even though he has mixed with some well known, highly respected Reformed Christians who have heartily endorsed him. He needs prayer. He needs to repent.

This series by John MacArthur showing Mark Driscoll’s mishandling of the “Song of Solomon” is absolutely shocking as well:

The Rape of Solomon's Song, Part 1
The Rape of Solomon's Song, Part 2
The Rape of Solomon's Song, Part 3
The Rape of Solomon's Song, Part 4

God help him...

Anonymous said...

Be sure to check out Les Puryear's blog today. He has something that will be especially near and dear to all your hearts.

http://lesliepuryear.blogspot.com/

Tom Parker said...

Disturbing at best.

Tom Parker said...

Anon:

You said:"Be sure to check out Les Puryear's blog today. He has something that will be especially near and dear to all your hearts.

http://lesliepuryear.blogspot.com/"

Mercy, mercy!

Anonymous said...

At least we know that someone loves Mac besides himself.

Sharon said...

Wowsers. First of all, some of these preachers sure have sex as a common theme. I think his detailed description is meant to titillate and does. He's up there describing a sex scene. So you can now get your porn kicks by listening to your preacher! Sex sells, and they've sure figured that one out. A lot more interesting hearing about the sex lives of other congregants than a boring subject like kindness.

By the way,preachers that even hint at their wonderful sex lives or preach on how you should be having a wonderful sex life-creep me out big time. It crosses a barrier that I think is good to keep in place. For the preachers or anybody else, I hope your sex life is wonderful, BUT I sure as heck don't want to hear about it. If that's not private, I'd like to know what is.

Also, the police could sure use his services.

Also, I'd love to hear all the happy endings in these stories. Wasn't it great how all the child molesters said, "Oh yeah, I did that to you years ago." Since he's required to notify authorities about these abuses of children, did he?

And the one funny part is how he starts out saying something about not making this ability public, and I'm assuming he's at a seminar or something on a stage, obviously being recorded and put on the Internet. If you don't want people to know this, why not keep it to yourself?

I think this is a sign of boredom with the same ole message at church. The preachers are now spicing things up a bit.

Anonymous said...

This is a scare tactic to the members. He is sending this out to scare anyone who may come against him that he is supernatural and will put a vooodooo hex on them if they go against God's anointed. Pure manipulation.....

Anonymous said...

I, too, have visions from time to time...usually after I eat pizza, chinese food or other spicy foods late at night just before I go to bed. It has nothing to do with being spiritual, just foolish dining choices as I get older.
Kyle

Larry Geiger said...

Thank you Kyle. One of the most cogent statements here today!

Anonymous said...

For those of you who think this goofball is outside the SBC mainstream think again. Recently a prominent SBC Pastor tweeted about his "great meeting" with Pastor Mark in Seattle.

What could be the purpose of this meeting? One can only imagine. Me thinks Mark has visions revealing the identity of anonymous bloggers and other "troublemakers" in the church. Just call him the "Pew Whisperer".

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

I wonder why Pastor Mark Driscoll only speaks of the sins of rape, molestation, adulterous sex in his visions.

What about other sins?

Does he have visions of the sins of greed? Did he have a vision of a man stealing money from his employer?

What about a vision of someone writing a tithe check that was 3% of gross instead of 10%?

The previous commenter is right on the money. This is about power.

First of all, what is to be gained by going public with this "gift"? He surely has to believe people will think he is a quack. It does no good to speak of it publicly, yet he does. Why?

Imagine if you're a staff member under Driscoll, or you're a lay leader at his church, a trustee or deacon or elder. And Driscoll now comes to you and says: "You all know deacon Bob Smith? He's an adulter [or liar/molestor/robber, you fill in the blank], and should be removed from his position. I saw him, just like watching TV, I saw him with a 5'6 brunette with blue eyes and long legs at the Motel 6 on a beige bedspread. He's a scoundrel. Remove him"

He now has power.

Shows you the difference between a mega church power pastor, and a two-bit chump in a small church: one guy uses a video cam to be the seeing-eye in the sky...one pastor just declares that he gets visions of sex scenes of his congregants.

Which is more perverted? Setting up a video camera to see women undress, or a pastor giving graphic details of a sexual encounter of one of his church members?

As Pastor Rod says, "worse and worse"

And worse.

Anonymous said...

WD,

You have not posted anything about this:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44142912/ns/local_news-new_york_ny/?ocid=ansmsnbc11

Sharon said...

Yes, it is interesting how he only sees sexually-related things. I think that would be what his mind is most focused on.

Ya'll are smarter than me. I think you've nailed it-it's about, "I'm putting you on notice that I'm a very powerful guy."

It just seems this kind of stuff is what turns groups into cults. Those in his church are being led by a very special man indeed. This man has powers that the ordinary man doesn't have.

Anonymous said...

Usually a preacher will preach most often on that which is his greatest weakness. For Mac, that's money. For this guy, its sex.

Sharon said...

Anon 11:57,
I'm not a preacher, but that makes total sense. We talk about things that are on our mind, things we're interested in. That's natural.

In fact I have to make a conscious effort to talk with people about a subject I have no interest in, but they do.

Sharon said...

Another thing. What happens to these people who hear these things? Are they okay with the preacher knowing such intimate details of their lives?

Does it help them to hear that their uncle or whoever abused them as a toddler?

How is any of this helpful to anyone? If I was sitting in the therapist's office and they told me they had a vision of something that happened to me as a toddler-I'd be shocked, scared, and burst into tears.

So it can't be about helping anybody. It MUST be about power and whatever jollies he gets by talking dirty to audiences.

Anonymous said...

What a joke! Does he really think people will believe him? Can someone tell me what the point of all that was?

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

It is about power, Anon.

If you are someone who has placed yourself under Driscoll's authority: minister or lay leader, or you are a trustee or elder...you NOW know that your pastor has the special power of seeing the hidden secret sins of his church members.

Imagine the power this must give him. If there is an elder or trustee that opposes him, he can say, "Brother, I had a vision, a vision just like a TV in front of me. I know about your secret sin. Please don't make me go to your wife about this...."

It is quackery, plain and simple. If I were a member at his church, this would be enough for me to pack it in and get completely away from him.

Anonymous said...

Ok based on my gift of discernment......and common sense;

RUN, as fast away from this TARE (and others like him) as quickly as you can.

And people actually listen to this kind of junk from Baptist?

Are people this weak and have such a bleak outlook on life that they actually believe this?

Tragic.

Anonymous said...

I see dumb people....

hip hop anonymous said...

It is not a mystery. He comes right out at the beginning and tells you exactly what he wants and is trying to accomplish.

0:46 "I'm not a guru, I'm not a freak. I don't talk about this, if I did talk about it everybody would want to meet with me and I would end up like one of those guys on tv."

Translation: "I see myself as a guru. Yes, I'm a freak. I am talking about this while telling you I dont talk about it because I want everyone to want to meet with me so I can be like one of those guys on tv."

He says "if I did talk about it then..." and he is talking about it so just take everything in the "then" and that equals what he wants.

Anonymous said...

I just had a vision of a man trying to mislead an entire group of people into thinking that he has some kind of magical powers to see into the past.

It was so clear. It was almost like it was playing right there on my computer monitor.

Seneca Griggs said...

We have discovered that Mark Driscoll is a sinner who sometimes pops off.

Stop the Presses. A sinner pastors a church. Who knew?

Anonymous said...

Seneca,

You forgot one word..........unrepentant. That's what makes it "news". An unrepentant sinner pastoring a church. Of course, this is not surprising news. However, it does require our attention.

Seneca Griggs said...

Captain Renault: I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here! [a croupier hands Renault a pile of money] Croupier: Your winnings, sir. ...

Paraphrasing Cpt. Renault: I'm shocked, shocked to find sinners in the pulpit. God: "Let me remind you of your sins Seneca."

DAWG Watchdog said...

Too bad he did not have a vision about you!

Tom Parker said...

Seneca:

I am quickly coming to believe you are a TROLL!

Anonymous said...

Seneca:

I am quickly coming to believe you are a TROLL!

August 18, 2011 3:25 PM

==============================
Anon 3:25
I came to that conclusion on his 1st post - never have believed any of his off the wall comments - he/she is one I just skip over.

Seneca Griggs said...

Tom Parker said; I am quickly coming to believe you are a TROLL!

And?

Tom, isn't Jax Watchdog ultimately a troll?

SMH said...

I am still trying to figure out the 4 yr old preacher. I am also eating Doritos Flamas for what that is worth.

Seneca Griggs said...

Anon 3.25 said; "Anon 3:25
I came to that conclusion on his 1st post - never have believed any of his off the wall comments - he/she is one I just skip over."

Anon, I believe you have taken the correct course. Less stress, better life.

Junkster said...

The most suspicious part is when he talks about people asking sexual abusers if they had abused them and the abusers say yes. People who know well they were abused can next to never get an abuser to admit it -- and yet we're supposed to believe that abusers are admitting to abusing people who don't even remember being abused? Yeah, right.

Not that the Holy Spirit can't tell people things, but I think true discernment is more like being able to tell that stories like this are either made up or extremely exaggerated.

Anonymous said...

The Holy Spirit spoke to Paul, Peter, John.....He still speaks to people today!!

This sermon was amazing...I wish my Pastor could do that stuff.

I had a bad childhood and my Pastor doesn't even know anything about it.

Anonymous said...

It is regrettable that Driscoll would go off on this type of mystical tangent.

Even though people have been critical of his ministry, some of it deserved, the guy is one of the clearest (he puts the cookies on the low shelf) Bible teachers out there.........

Anonymous said...

"This sermon was amazing...I wish my Pastor could do that stuff."

He can! Just get up there before an audience of 1500 people, while the music crescendos and then starts softly playing, and say "every head bowed, every eye closed." Then the good part:

"I see a person out there, you've been living in shame for years and years since you were abused by someone you trusted. Yes. If that's you, look up at me - right from your seat. And now, with all heads bowed, every eye still closed, I want you to just raise your hand if you are that person. Yes. Yes. I see that hand. And that one. Oh glory. Hands are goin' up all over this auditorium tonight..."

And afterwards, at the small group meetings, everyone discusses what a great annointing there was. How Pastor So-and-so had a word of knowledge. How he is a man of great visions, yaddah, yaddah, yaddah. Isn't he just wonderful!?

Anonymous said...

What about a vision of someone writing a tithe check that was 3% of gross instead of 10%?

bwahahahaha

And you're right, WD. It's about power and creating fear among the staff and sycophants. It will keep them in line. Our former mystic pastor was more subtle, but when he said "I know your heart," it was still intimidating. He didn't know our hearts, but he sure put on a good act, and even years after we left the church, I still scanned parking lots for his car out of fear. It's a strange thing how much power they can wield with a few culty tactics. It's worse with a big church like Driscoll's. I'd run and not look back if I were at Mars Hill now.

Anonymous said...

If I remember correctly, this is several years old from a series on spiritual warfare that was originally presented to the staff of Mars Hill before being released for everyone else.

It's a four part series and most of it is pretty nutty. You might want to give it a listen. Some of Pastor Mark's wisdom has mysteriously disappeared from the internet - it would be a shame if this nugget would likewise vanish.

Anonymous said...

This is Bible preaching!

Jesus gives some the gift of Wisdom.

Pastor Mark is a great man of God.

He is so funny and brings the Word to my heart.

My Mother went to a Church of God and they did this stuff every Sunday.

Are YOU anti-Bible?

This happens every Sunday at my Assembly of God Church.

My Pastor healed a guy last Sunday of Kidney Stones.

Anonymous said...

This guy is crazy!

I live in Charlotte and Steven Furtick is just like him!

Elevation kicked a disabled kid in a wheelchair out of a church service for saying "Amen"!

Our local news covered it, these "Pastors" are scary!

WishIhadknown said...

“My Pastor healed a guy last Sunday of Kidney Stones.”

Nah, I think that was more my favorite Bible promise, “It came to pass.”

Personally, I'd rather be healed by God.

brandleberry said...

I agree with Junkster. No abuser is going to own up to any sin, let alone molesting a kid (esp. his grandkid) if that kid was too young to remember. I think Driscoll is talking about his own experience, not someone else's. He's makin it up as he goes along.

Anonymous said...

It doesn't surprise me that a Mega Church pastor would have such visions, but I highly doubt they're coming from God.

Hello.

Anonymous said...

I'm seeing a vision of a lot of megachurch pastors going to hell.

Sharon said...

Douglas,
The other day you posted "The Rape of Song of Solomon." I just finished reading it all. If he really did preach this at a Sunday morning service with children, etc., I'm more than shocked. And why in Scotland?

I'm almost done reading a book about Warren Jeffs, the FLDS cult leader. Driscoll's deal and Jeffs' deal seem very similar to me.

I honestly cannot imagine well-informed, regular people attending Driscoll's church after being subjected to such inappropriate material from the pulpit. And his wife goes along with his saying such things publicly?? Unreal.

Maybe Driscoll, Furtick, etc. are just the fresh crop of faith healers but with a sexual twist.

Anonymous said...

Seneca Griggs is a TROLL!

Do not read or respond to his comments.

Douglas said...

Sharon, talking about the false teacher Furtick, have a listen to this really scary stuff:: Steven Furtick Preaches About Steven Furtick...Again

and then have a listen to how Rick Warren rips another portion of Scripture out of context and pour HIS own meaning into it to talk about himself and others and removes the LORD Jesus Christ completely from the text, scary, he doesn’t even blush at his sinful, evil, wickedness: Rick Warren Evicts Jesus from Isaiah 49 Rick Warren has a heck of a lot to answer to God for and he doesn’t even tremble at God’s word. If I was him, I would be jumping at the rustling of the leaves on a shadowy, foggy moonlight night. Freaking at that bump in the night. Death is only a heart beat away and he hasn’t repented of any of his multitude of false teachings or Scripture twisting's over the years. Frightening.

America is in dark days alright and it’s getting worse and the rotten leaven from America is spreading around the globe, constantly. Other countries are reaping the whirlwind as well. America has a real hard road ahead. All western countries have. God will bring a nation that twists His word, in the pulpit and in the public square, to its knees, to its face into the dirt. God is NOT mocked.

Lin said...

It is like the 700 Club with tatty clothes and sex talk.

Notice how everything with Mark is about sex and power? Disasterous combo.

My hope is that more and more people will run away from this guy.

Anonymous said...

"It is quackery, plain and simple. If I were a member at his church, this would be enough for me to pack it in and get completely away from him."

I think this video is from 2008. And his churches are stil going strong. In fact, the SBC, in various forms, is supporting some church plants by Acts 29...... which is Driscoll....all the way. (don't let them fool you about that one)


Think of the Acts 29 Boot Camp, training young mushy ministry minds in this Driscoll sex and power stuff.

Coming to an area near you?

Anonymous said...

Seneca Griggs could be Jon Estes. Sounds just like him.

Anonymous said...

I was thinking the same thing.

If he tries to invoke "touch not mine anointed" or claims that verses about gluttony are really a prohibition on cannibalism, we will now for sure.

I noticed that when WD said something to Estes about being famous (in the SBC) for blindly supporting baptist mega-church pastors in trouble - he disappeared.

Perhaps he has resurfaced under a pseudonym to protect his reputation.

I can see why he wouldn't want the comments posted on this thread to be attributed to his real name.

Anonymous said...

Wasn't Estes the one who was constantly criticizing others for posting anonymous comments?

Wouldn't it be just like him to post under a false name? A perfect combination of dishonesty and hypocrisy.

Come on Jon - I mean Seneca - you'll need to do better than that.

At least change up your writing style so it's not so easy.

Tom Parker said...

I think we all know Jon is still with us among these comments.

Confession is good for the soul, Jon.

Anonymous said...

According to Les Puryear's blog, what today's churches need more of is pastors who:

* trespass on private property to attempt to intimidate staff

* keep pedophiles on staff for 6 months to avoid another scandal

* send his goons over to a member's house to warn them about saying amen too loudly in church

* immediately increases his salary over the previous pastor and keeps the congregation from knowing the amount

* says he doesn't preach on Wednesday nights to spend more time with his family - yet lines up paid for Wednesday night sermons in other churches

* writes a book condemning young pastors for accepting expensive gifts from church members and then does it himself

* misinterpret scripture when it benefits him personally (tithe)

* exaggerates or modifies news stories to make them fit the sermon

* serve a church member's family with trespass papers

* passes a petition to attempt to ban all criticism of a pastor

Is this what we need more of? Of is this a huge part of the problem.

Anonymous said...

Les should have used Ergun Caner instead of Mac Brunson in his: Men Who Preach the Truth story. That would have been funnier.

Seneca Griggs said...

I do not know "Jon Estes" or the person who posts as "Jon Estes" but I'm beginning to think he could be my BFF.

I find it a little strange to believe that the "we-are-of-one-mind" commentors on this blog can't acknowledge the possibility of other perspectives.

BTW, did Jax Watchdog say how much money he made of his lawsuit against the city? I'd certainly love to know. I wonder how much his lawyer made off the lawsuit too. Probably close to 1/2.

Anonymous said...

"I'm seeing a vision of a lot of megachurch pastors going to hell."

Along with BLOGGERS!!!

Anonymous said...

"Along with BLOGGERS!!!"

Along with TROLLS!!!

Anonymous said...

"I do not know "Jon Estes" or the person who posts as "Jon Estes" but I'm beginning to think he could be my BFF."

It's not a compliment my friend.

You could sum up Jon with this statement: "often wrong but never in doubt."

Anonymous said...

"I find it a little strange to believe that the "we-are-of-one-mind" commentors on this blog can't acknowledge the possibility of other perspectives."

The "we-are-of-one-mind" commentators understand that there are lots of kool-aid drinkers like you Jon - I mean Seneca. That's why the mega-churches are still half full even after the pastor has so many scandals.

It's just that you don't often read comments this kooky from two different people in the same place.

It's possible that two different people have swastikas carved into their foreheads, but Manson is the only one I know about. So it's a safe assumption.

Anonymous said...

"I find it a little strange to believe that the "we-are-of-one-mind" commentors on this blog can't acknowledge the possibility of other perspectives."

The "we-are-of-one-mind" commentators understand that there are lots of kool-aid drinkers like you Jon - I mean Seneca. That's why the mega-churches are still half full even after the pastor has so many scandals.

It's just that you don't often read comments this kooky from two different people in the same place.

It's possible that two different people have swastikas carved into their foreheads, but Manson is the only one I know about. So it's a safe assumption.

Anonymous said...

seneca, the whole point is you have no 'perspective'. you offer nothing of content. you are just arrogant and pompous in defending what believers know to be willful and continual sin by those paid to be christians.

Anonymous said...

"BTW, did Jax Watchdog say how much money he made of his lawsuit against the city? I'd certainly love to know. I wonder how much his lawyer made off the lawsuit too. Probably close to 1/2."

Perhaps the lesson to learn here Jon - I mean Seneca - is not to use members of the police department on your staff to violate privacy law.

That way the city doesn't get sued and your tithes end up going to the pastor's 6 figure salary instead of to the Dog's blogging fund.

Anonymous said...

Les Puryear on Twitter:
"Wonder what percentage of new church plants funded by NAMB in the past five years are led by Calvinist pastors? I'm looking into it."

I hope Les gets a job soon. He seems to have too much time on his hands.

Sharon said...

Douglas,
Thanks for the link. It messed up maybe about halfway through, but I was actually finding it very interesting.

Of course it kinda illustrates how there's nothing new under the sun. I mean, in my background (ind. fund. baptist)it's always revolved around the personality of the preacher. Each Independent Baptist church is like it's own little kingdom with the preacher being the king. Furtick and others seem to be the same thing, only much more "hip." If there's one thing preachers weren't in my day, it was "hip." lol

I'm now agnostic, so you and I are obviously coming from different viewpoints, but it seems we're both capable of seeing how this stuff really works. I don't think Jesus is the Superstar in any branch of Christianity. You have your conservative stars, your mega-church stars, your Calvinist stars, etc. Maybe that's just natural, I don't know.

Anonymous said...

"seneca, the whole point is you have no 'perspective'. you offer nothing of content. you are just arrogant and pompous in defending what believers know to be willful and continual sin by those paid to be christians."

Exactly! You are adding nothing to the conversation. We already know that you are going to support the preacher not matter what he does.

Being a sycophant is not another perspective.

I often wonder what it would take for these kool-aid drinkers to say something that a baptist preacher did was wrong.

We know from the past that lying for a decade from the pulpit, covering for a known pedophile, promoting a pyramid scheme from the pulpit, misinterpreting scripture for personal gain (power or money) isn't sin according to the kool-aid drinkers. What exactly would it take? I'm curious.

Steward said...

Hey, maybe he's Johnny from "Dead Zone"??? For those of you who have never seen that TV series, Sorry.

- jared

Tom Parker said...

Sharon:

These men and women pastors are to be the leading servant of their churches. But that has definitely been forgotten by too many of the men pastors in the SBC.

Anonymous said...

Wow!

This is the first time I have ever heard Mark Driscoll speak. A few observations.

GREAT voice and presence. It's unique. He is not (as far as I can tell) copying anyone. That is hard to do. Most seminary students and young preachers copy or mimic their favorites.

The Mickey Mouse thing diminishes it for me, too, but I can see why it works for lots of people.

Now - on to the substance.

I cannot believe, based on all that I have heard about this guy, that he would say such things in public with a straight face.

I am elder at my church. If our pastor said these things, he would have to apologize next week and probably see a psychologist or he would be fired.

This sort of thing is ridiculous.

First, it is patently untrue. I suspect he knows it to be, and that is a bigger problem than if he is simply garden variety delusional.

Second, it is twisting the discernment gift.

Third, it holds the church up to ridicule.

Fourth, it shows that in counseling situations, he is completely inappropriate.

Based on this video alone (have not heard or seen him before) he should not be ministering in a church or in any area of great responsibility.

Why would anyone stay in his church after hearing this?

Louis

Tom Parker said...

If anyone has looked at Les's recent post is he saying he is a Prophet like Steve Gaines?

Anonymous said...

I am sick and tired of garbage like this Blog.

I am sick and tired of hate and venom towards God's Man.

I am sick and tired of YOU taking things out of context.

I am sick and tired of little tiny weennie dogs barking at God's Pit Bulls.

I am sick and tired of it....

AND GOD IS TOO!!!!!!!!!!

New BBC Open Forum said...

Don't let the door hit you on the way out then, Troll 1:27. No one is forcing you to come here.

Watchdog, your troll filter really needs to be adjusted.

Anonymous said...

RE: the comment
Fourth, it shows that in counseling situations, he is completely inappropriate.

Very. And I wonder how many people actually READ the counseling agreements their churches have them sign. They'll start off saying it's confidential, then in subsequent paragraphs they will basically say they can put it on a billboard if they want to.

A lot of the prayer people and people leading groups are also there to help compile files on people and distort aspects of what they've said or done.

Unless you REALLY trust someone, just know that if you tell it to a megachurch, it can and will be used against you in whatever fashion they see fit.

Anonymous said...

"Wonder what percentage of new church plants funded by NAMB in the past five years are led by Calvinist pastors? I'm looking into it."


I wonder how many Acts 29 (Dricoll) churches are planted with NAMB money.

MRWBBIII said...

JOHN MACARTHUR - ROB BELL RICK WARREN MARK DRISCOLL SERMON JAM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HidbQZMKVI

Seneca Griggs said...

Some of my recent comments from a day or two ago have not appeared?

Partial ban or just removing comments JW Dog doesn't like.

Well it is his blog where all comments are welcome except those that aren't.

Seneca Griggs said...

Oops, there it is.

Apologies if Tom doesn't actually edit/remove comments though he could.

You gotta be tough.

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Don't blame me Mr. Griggs if some of your posts don't go through. I have activated the TrollDetector 2.0 software for all comments. It uses a sophisticated text evaluation algorithm to detect off-topic, flaming, or antagonistic posts that serve no purpose. ;)

Anonymous said...

Driscoll's theology is not the issue. His psychology, however, should be of great concern. The dude is sick...really sick. I would not let my kids get within a mile of him.

Thy Peace said...

Off Topic: Wade Burleson > The Reason the SBC Will Not Create a Minister Sex Abuse Data Base Is Liability, Not Polity

Anonymous said...

"It uses a sophisticated text evaluation algorithm to detect off-topic, flaming, or antagonistic posts that serve no purpose."

I would ask for my money back if I were you. If that software was working properly, none of his comments would ever be posted.

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Wow, Anon, you are right!! Look, your worthless post made it through the filter!

:)

Anonymous said...

You gotta love Jon - I mean Seneca Griggs.

First he accuses WD of deleting his silly comments, and then on his next post he criticizes him for not removing his comments.

Thanks for the brilliant commentary SG.

Anonymous said...

I was referring to SG's comments not yours.

WishIhadknown said...

So is being a “Calvinist” the same as being an unbeliever?

Patti Stephen said...

i personally have listened to Mark Driscoll for years on the internet via Itunes. i have read his books, i have followed his history of how he became a christian and knowing the demographics of the church he leads in Seattle--the church is surrounded with all kinds of individuals who are afflicted with sins such as he describes...the town is very liberal, there is a lot of mystical spiritual phenomenom that exists very strongly in that town.... he is a very commited godly man; he is committed to God's word; he is generous, gifted in teaching and he is a non-compromising Bible teacher. He may be a little too conservative for many people's tastes, but he is strong on wanting to build godly homes, building up men to be leaders...i strongly admire him. know he is not perfect and he has been criticized for many things in the past...but he has been a teachable person, he is accountable to his leadership team. He does not control them like some of these SBC mega pastors do of their leaders and congregation. i was upset to see some of the stupid ignorant (yes i believe many of these comments were made ignorantly without knowing the context of his sermon or about the people to whom he regularly preaches....)and i do not apologize for that. i have agreed most of the time probably 95% of the time with the Watchdog, but this is one time that think he missed it....just picking on this sermon and pastor because of all the other truly misleading pastors he has made reference to in the past.

here's a link on youtube about Mark Driscoll really chewing out some of the men in his church because of how they treat their women...(mostly he is referring to newer believers or other men who are living with their girlfriends) and again much of his congregation are single young people in their mid twenties to thirties/forties. i really appreciate his commitment to the truth and that he's not afraid to stand up for what is right.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkaeAkJO0w8

Tom Kelley said...

Patti Stephen,
Pointing out problems in a man's teaching or ministry does not negate the good things he may have also taught. Nor do the good things make him immune to criticism for his errors.

I'm glad that you have been blessed by some of Driscoll's ministry. But he's just a man, no better or worse than any other. And no more or less special than any other preacher. Please don't elevate him above anyone else. Test everything by the Word, and follow Christ, not man.

-----
Tom

Tom Parker said...

Patti:

Do you believe what Driscoll is saying about seeing things?

Thy Peace said...

Wade Burleson > The Problem of Authoritarianism in the Conservative Pulpits of America [JANUARY 14, 2009]

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Patti - I've really never had anything to say about Driscoll.

But please don't tell me all the wonderful things he says and does. The man claims to see the detailed, sexual sins of church members from 10 years prior. And in one of his tales he sprung the gory details of a wife's sexual sin right in front of her husband. The guy is sick and he needs help. Or if he has gotten help, he should tell us.

I liked George W. Bush. I agreed with many of his polices. But if ever, even one time in front of the camera claims that he has visions of foreign leaders as clear as a TV screen, and knows their sins and their past, forget it. He is nuts, and he can't be president. I don't care what else I agree with him about, he can't be president if he says he has detailed visions.

Driscoll is either a liar, or he is nuts. He doesn't see visions of sexual sins of his members.

Patti Stephen said...

yes I believe that he does have these "knowings" but even he said they are not all the time; he doesn't even know when they will happen. i listened to that whole sermon series a couple of years ago and i have personally experienced some of the demonic oppression and situations which he describes. I am not a charismatic person at all. i don't have visions; i don't speak in tongues; but i do not limit God in anyway if He choses to work in a certain fashion. i am very reformed in my theology, as is he, and i don't believe that most people who claim to have visions or other things are all that together -- but if you listen to his sermon sound-byte... he will say--several times-- that this is not a regular occurrence. And it is NOT always about sex....it usually is about someone who is being mistreated or abused-- like the one wife who was being beat by her husband.. as said, i do not limit the Holy Spirit's ability to work in someone's life as He has done with Mark Driscoll. This man has lived a consistent, open life and has been very accountable to his staff and leaders. He is not the one in charge and he would never go to one of his elders and speak one of these vision about him if the guy did not agree with him...that is sheer ignorance... i don't agree with everything he says, but he is usually always very theologically sound.

i have had similar type situations, though not as detailed or specific as he has had - with the gift of discernment that i know i have - and i can look back over my life and see that the times when it has been most accurate and specific has been when i have been walking in obedience in the Spirit... when i have been "in the flesh" or just not as intimate or close to the Lord - then i have noticed that i have not been able to be as sensitive to others to discern their situations as the opportunity arose... most of what i've discerned have been about someone's character or something about them - or that something bad was going to happen, etc. and i've had no pre-knowledge of the situation or of the person...but i have usually been right...and i can assure you - it's not the kind of gift that i would want or wish on anyone...because it's painful to see situations or people and just "know" or "see" behind the curtain -- and watch something happen....even when i've tried to warn the person or persons about the situation - they would not always listen...

so yes... i do believe what he said is true....i am not crazy; i am a thinking intelligent woman. i am a graduate of Moody Bible institute in Chicago (1983)and i have the utmost respect for this man and know that the Lord is blessing his congregation and people are coming to know Jesus every week...and are growing in the knowledge of His word.

Tom Parker said...

Patti:

I'm sorry but I read no were in the NT of current Pastor's having the gift of specific visions.

Anonymous said...

What happened to Les Puryear's blog? Everytime I click on it they say its gone.

Someone needs to have a vision and tell me where it went. That is unless you are a Calvinist.

Anonymous said...

I have no problems with a pastor having a vision sent from God. If He can use the jawbone of an ass, surely he can use a Baptist preacher.

Anonymous said...

Patti said, "Here's a link on youtube about Mark Driscoll really chewing out some of the men in his church..."

I watched that link. He did that in front of the whole congregation, a mixed audience with children in attendance. The man has some serious issues. Sick.

Patti also said, "He is accountable to his leadership team. He does not control them like some of these SBC mega pastors do of their leaders and congregation."

LOL.
The church was at one time an elder-led church with a plurality of elders. He wanted to scrap the church bylaws and remove the legal voting rights of all the elders, except for him and whoever he handpicked to be his "executive elder" team. When two of the church's senior pastors questioned the wisdom of this, he had them fired for "sinfully questioning". Then he had the church's bylaws changed and installed himself for an "indefinite" term, with no accountability. But don't take my word for it. See:

The New York Times

YouTube

Praying Heart

Anonymous said...

They must give a book out to pastors on how to intimidate lay people. They all use the same tricks.

When I questioned Jon Estes about his view on tithing, he used out of context scripture to try to claim that I was "asking silly questions" when I was really asking logical follow up questions to his claims. Apparently the questions become "silly" when he can't answer them without contradicting himself.

This teaching also contradicts what Paul said about the Bereans.

They also like to use "touch not God's anointed." But Jon couldn't show how "touch" meant "criticize" nor could he explain who the current day prophets and kings are (that are mentioned in the verse).

Anonymous said...

"Sinful Questioning"
The 11th commandment.

Anonymous said...

And people wonder why so many of (we) believers have stopped going to church.

Watched poor Mac on TV yesterday with a droopy face saying what a discouraging time he is going through. Sorry Mac, your operational skills is the reason your church is going down - not the economy! First Baptist Church of Jacksonville has gone downhill since the day Brunson arrived.

Mega Church Pastor's are loosing their members (and staff) back to the small churches!

On the positive side, Mac's ad on the website with the upscale cruise ship is very nice!

Tom Parker said...

Anon:

You said"What happened to Les Puryear's blog? Everytime I click on it they say its gone.

Someone needs to have a vision and tell me where it went. That is unless you are a Calvinist.

August 22, 2011 7:59 AM"

He's probably doing another do over of his blog to attempt to get rid of the recent activity on his blog.

I'm not sure he has much credibility left.

Anonymous said...

"First Baptist Church of Jacksonville has gone downhill since the day Brunson arrived."

That's what WD hopes for!

Seneca Griggs said...

Mac Brunson is not a handsome man is he. Maybe they didn't call him to be pastor for his looks.

Their satellite campus is doing well. It appears the church continues to grow despite Mac's "droopy face."

Anonymous said...

"Mac Brunson is not a handsome man is he. Maybe they didn't call him to be pastor for his looks."

Maybe they didn't call him to split the church, reduce membership, receive a large land gift (after warning others not to do that in a book he wrote), pass resolutions against any criticism (even when it is deserved), or use staff to violate privacy rights and then hand out trespass papers to a member and his family - either.

Anonymous said...

"Their satellite campus is doing well. It appears the church continues to grow despite Mac's "droopy face."

But their main campus (which is the vast majority of their membership) is declining.

Perhaps he should get a face lift.

Anonymous said...

Now that you mentioned it, Mac is starting to look a bit like the cartoon character "Droopy Dog" holding the sign that reads: "I'm So Happy!"

Anonymous said...

Mac Brunson
Ergun Caner
Steve Gaines

Those boys like to eat don't they?

Anonymous said...

Mr. Griggs,
You surely must have been called to represent First Baptist here on this blog. The leadership has to just love you being on watch for them 24/7 and putting in a good word for their deeds.

Actually Mac's not a bad looking dude, and he sure has a good looking family.

Moses Model said...

He said that everything he sees is not always accurate. What other type of crazy stories has he told people that were wrong?

Seneca Griggs said...

I haven't seen Mac's family so I wouldn't know if they are good looking or not.
Haven't ever been at FBC when he is preaching, I do enjoy him on the radio, 88.7, in the morning. He's very good.

Anonymous said...

I thank God for my membership at First Baptist Church.

I bring my Bible in my hand, my tithe in my pocket, and a song in my heart.

I hear God's man bring God's Word behind the sacred desk and it thrills my heart.

The haters will not win.
The Devil will not win.
The Liberals will not win.

This battle belongs to the Lord and no weapon formed against us will prosper.

We rejoice in the trash on this blog because we must be doing something right to have so much oppostion.

They don't build statues to Critics...(and YOU know who YOU are)

Anonymous said...

For the last 2 posters, how does the Kool-Aid taste boys?

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Ouch. Your post is full of misunderstandings. I feel sorry for you.

If by tithe, you mean 10%, you're woefully short. You need to bring 23% to meet the OT tithe.

Your preacher is not a special "God's man". He is just a "man". Who preaches for a living.

And he does not "bring God's Word" - you bring God's Word in your bible. He is just delivering a sermon, to perhaps, at best, help you better understand the bible and to apply it. But in no way, shape or form is he delivering "God's Word". In fact, be very careful to examine what he says, that it is true, and that he doesn't read too much into what scripture says and lead you astray.

The "haters", the "devil", and the "liberals", as you define them, ARE indeed winning. Your post reflects this, sad to say.

Having opposition does not ensure that you are "doing something right". That is completely illogical and dangerous thinking, but it is indeed what your pastor is teaching you. That is what cults are made of, so be careful.

Who cares who gets a statue built? But actually, there are some great statutes and monuments of wonderful critics in both our U.S. government and the Christian faith. Ever see statues and monuments of our founding fathers who "criticized" the British government? Did you ever hear of Martin Luther?

If your post is genuine, then you really have been duped by your pastor into some serious false thinking. Better check yourself before you wreck yourself. :)

Anonymous said...

Great comments WD. Thanks for addressing their bad thinking.

Let's pray that none of these Kool-Air drinkers ever gets into any kind of position of authority.

Of course, that is unlikely since man-worshiping tends to be a followers role rather than a leader.

Anonymous said...

If you really believe all that stuff you just wrote I feel sorry for your church and pastor. You will be nothing but a malcontent (I know you love to be called that) the rest of your life. Its kind of sad because I imagine at one time in your life you were probably a productive church member.

Anonymous said...

"If you really believe all that stuff you just wrote I feel sorry for your church and pastor."

Notice how the TROLL doesn't address any of the issues (for example how they gave 23% in the OT and he thinks he is doing God a favor by giving 10%), but instead attacks the person.

Oldest trick in the book.

Yawn.

Anonymous said...

"You will be nothing but a malcontent (I know you love to be called that) the rest of your life."

TROLL doesn't notice the irony. He is a malcontent on this blog, and it looks like he will be for the rest of his life.

Anonymous said...

"Its kind of sad because I imagine at one time in your life you were probably a productive church member."

Productive member = kool-aid drinker.

Anonymous said...

Anon 8:42

You sound like one of Gadafi's loyalists who say they are winning in Tripoli when we all know it's not true.

I used to "love" First Baptist" and was a happy member just like yourself until Mac Brunson was hired.

First Baptist is no longer 1st - in fact, it's now #3 in the community, and let me just add the sister churches at the beaches really aren't that happy with them coming to their territory either.

Anonymous said...

My Mother is in a nursing home.

She is a long time member of First Baptist.

One of her nursing aides asked her where she went to Church and when she told her it was FBC, the nursing aide laughed and said, "Oh that is where the people write Blogs against their Pastor and stir up trouble." Mom had never heard of mess like this...This brought my Mother to tears.


Congrats Dog....My Mom couldn't sleep last night because of you.

Anonymous said...

"Congrats Dog....My Mom couldn't sleep last night because of you."

Dude, that was laugh out loud funny.

Seriously, is this how desperate you are to demean someone? To make up an insane story like that?

You are a real loser my friend!

Get a job and most of your obsession with this blog will go away.

Anonymous said...

One of her nursing aides asked her where she went to Church and when she told her it was FBC, the nursing aide laughed and said, "Oh that is where the people write Blogs against their Pastor and stir up trouble." Mom had never heard of mess like this...This brought my Mother to tears.



Did she also say (whoever that nice person was)that FBCJax is a place for rule of law instead of the law of GOD.

Anonymous said...

I used to "love" First Baptist" and was a happy member just like yourself until Mac Brunson was hired.

Stumbled In!

Anonymous said...

If this caused his mother to have a heart attack, could there be room for legal action?

We need to shut this thing down now.

It is tearing God's family apart.

I feel so bad for his mother.

Anonymous said...

"Congrats Dog....My Mom couldn't sleep last night because of you."

Excuse me Anon. You must think that he cares!

Anonymous said...

"let me just add the sister churches at the beaches really aren't that happy with them coming to their territory either."

STRANGE. Why are they not whining and moaning about Andy Stanley and others outside of Florida coming into town. HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM?

New BBC Open Forum said...

Seneca Griggs could be Jon Estes. Sounds just like him.

"Seneca" is not JLE. Trust me.

What happened to Les Puryear's blog? Everytime I click on it they say its gone.

It's still visible in Google Reader. If you still want to read a specific post, just ask.

Anonymous said...

I felt so sorry for our Pastor this past Sunday.

The pressure is getting to him, he used to have more hair, so it is affecting him physically.

There is a short older man who sits on the far right, near the stage every single Sunday.

He started crying during the message and I heard him whisper..."I wish those people would leave him alone"....

So sad that there are people like you Tom that are beating a good man like Pastor Brunson down.

Hope you feel good about that.

Thy Peace said...

He started crying during the message and I heard him whisper..."I wish those people would leave him alone"....

In the last 20 posts of this blog, only one post referenced Mac Brunson and that too obliquely. Is Mac still crying about bloggers in his sermons? He needs to get a life.

Anonymous said...

This blog is obsessed with Mac. You should know it and realize it when you come on here. It does make for good reading though because it just shows you how evil mankind has become.

Anonymous said...

"I feel so bad for his mother."

There is no mother.
This was written by a sick lying TROLL!!!

Anonymous said...

"I wish those people would leave him alone"....

LEAVE BRITTANY ALONE!!!!!!!!!

Anonymous said...

This blog is obsessed with Mac.

This thread is about Driscoll.
You are obsessed with this blog.

Anonymous said...

WD is there no way to get rid of this village idiot that keeps posting his ignorant comments here?

The made-up stories about dying mothers is getting really old.

He's making accusations of you being obsessed with Mac on a thread that isn't even about Mac.

He needs professional help.

Thy Peace said...

A good sermon that addresses some of the later comments in this blog post: Emmanuel - Enid > Series in "Ephesians" [1997] > A Holy Temple - God's Presence in us (Ephesians 2:18-22)

Tom Parker said...

"It's still visible in Google Reader. If you still want to read a specific post, just ask."

Why does anyone think he is doing it this way instead of the previous way?

Anonymous said...

My heart breaks for Mac.

He is such a wonderful man with a real heart for God.

He is being treated like a dog..(no pun intended)

Anonymous said...

This blog is obsessed with Mac. You should know it and realize it when you come on here. It does make for good reading though because it just shows you how evil mankind has become.

August 23, 2011 3:31 PM

Disagree with your comments . . .it's not just Mac Brunson, it's most all the mega pastors who have come to abuse the pulpit - as far as Mac, he's not a humble man, hangs with the country club members, not the common folks. What I do agree is that mankind has become evil - even our pastors!

Anonymous said...

Still waiting on purify the church. No stuff no threat. It is what i figured.

Anonymous said...

Mac is considered one of the leading Pastors in the US..

Who are you?

Mac is considered one of the best Spiritual Leaders in the US..

What are you?

Mac is considered one of the leading candidates for President of the SBC?

How about you?

If you are not the lead dog, the scenery never changes.

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

"Who are you?" you ask.

I am....

Watchdog.

:)

Woof.

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

And I have a seersucker suit, bowtie, monogrammed cuffs, and fancy cufflinks.

Who are YOU?

Provender said...

One common way that spiritual abuse continues in a cult-like church is for defenders of the abusers to try to drum up sympathy for the abuser. They can do this in many ways. A favorite is to charge persecution by "the enemy." The enemy is anyone who brings even legitimate criticism. The circle-the-wagons mentality tries to draw the rest of the congregation into a posture of defending the poor, defenseless pastor. You can see this with large cults and small and in most abusive churches. Those who "defend" their abusive pastors sometimes have their jobs or livelihoods at stake. Or their position in the church. Often, they are on the church payroll, but sometimes they simply fear the leadership. It is common for them to turn the tables on the abused. The victims of spiritual abuse are charged with having a critical spirit or a divisive attitude. Criticism -- sometimes even for illegal or unethical activities -- becomes persecution or "attacks." The Watchdog blog is a wonderful resource because not only does it highlight current abusive situations, but in the comments defending these situations you catch a glimpse of the common language of spiritual abusers and their supporters, in living color. Thanks, Watchdog, for providing this valuable resource.

New BBC Open Forum said...

And cool hair and a tan!

Tom Parker,

He really has deleted it. What I meant was if you subscribed to it in Google Reader before, all the posts are still visible. Once a blog is deleted it's usually too late to subscribe (sometimes you can still successfully subscribe for a short time), but if you were already subscribed you still have a permanent record of all the posts. Anyone have any requests for reposts?

turnureyesonJC said...

I am sick on my stomach as I read for the first time all these lies about my Pastor. I heard about this blog from the Pulpit as he preached recently on critics. I can see now why he is losing more of his hair, the hair line is almost down to his ears.
I am pulling out my hair as well after reading all these lies.

Like a famous lawyer said once.....

If it does not fit, you must acquit!

FBC Jax Watchdog said...

Yes, he has been preaching on critics. He and Perry Noble have recently been talking from their high horse about critics.

Yes, criticizing the critics, they can't see their own hypocrisy in that...but they do it in Jesus name, and for His sake, misusing scripture in the process, so it is all ok.

I'll have more to say very soon on Mac Brunson's series in Job, especially his spending weeks in reading into scripture lessons that are just not there. Pretty pathetic, I feel very sorry for the folks at FBCJ.

Sharon said...

I just read that Phil Driscoll can get the housing allowance on his second home as well as on the first. Evidently if you had 100 homes, all is well, if you are clergy. I'm so glad this subject is getting out into the open.

WWJD? Well, evidently he would certainly fight for all his tax breaks on all his homes. These wealthy ministers have no shame.

There's an article in the Wall Street Journal.

Anonymous said...

Someone needs to get to the nursing home and tell that poor woman about following Christ instead of men...quickly. And I am not joking. Please tell her not to idolize a legal entity with a steeple or lighthouse. The Body of Christ is something all together different. It puts Christ first before a human.

I am serious people. Get a grip about what you believe.

Anonymous said...

"I am sick on my stomach as I read for the first time all these lies about my Pastor."

Well then don't read them.

Didn't your pastor warn you about reading this blog?

Why are you disobeying our pastor?

Anonymous said...

The housing allowance should only be on your primary residence according to the IRS I thought. Any mone dedicated for that purpose has to be spent on that residence. If someone know any more about that then tell me. I want to know can I buy a piece of property for a future home while living in the parsonage and dedicate money with in reason to pay for the land under housing allowance? Eventhough you live in a parsonage you can personally dedicate a portion of your salary within reason a housing allowance.

Anonymous said...

I think Fred Luter will be the next SBC President if he decides to run.

Mark said...

This guy is bizarre. He reminds me of the "faith healers." They claim a lot, but there's no proof. I will bet that you will NEVER hear any of the people he claims to have had visions about come forward and say that it happened like he said it did.
Lesson: Never believe a preacher when he says things like this unless you hear it from the horses mouth that it happened.
He feigns humility by saying that he "doesn't talk about it" yet talks in great detail in this sermon.
He seems like the type who gets his jollies by talking about sex in public forums like he does. Definitely a minister to STAY AWAY FROM!

Anonymous said...

This guy is a wolf and what bothers me is that James Mac Donald promotes this guy.Not to mention the other wolves that he supports. I do believe in "birds of feather flock together." What I'm hoping will happen is that Mac Donald will eventually disassociate from these people but right now I don't see this happening.

I believe that if Mac Donald keeps going the way he is, then the truth that he is one of them will be evident.If not already.